A little nostalgia this morning
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From: Peter on 3 Jul 2010 21:30 "Allen" <allent(a)austin.rr.com> wrote in message news:RPydnUmwG-5LO7LRnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d(a)giganews.com... > Savageduck wrote: > <snip> >> Been there, done that. That was a long time ago, I didn't buy the >> Tee-shirt, or the ears. That was only because an overseas visitor wanted >> the experience. From my point of view, money wasted, a perfect example of >> ugly American artificiality and corporate greed. I am not impressed with, >> and I don't like what Disneyland/World is selling. >> Give me the National Parks, Yosemite, Zion, Sequoia-Kings Canyon, the >> Redwoods, Adirondacks, Death Valley, or Big Sur for real "fun" and >> America. >> ...but that is not you is it? >> > <snip> > Sounds like my son. He went to Disneyland when he was seven years old. > Looked around at a lot of things. When he left he said to his mother > "Everything in there is plastic". That's the only thing he said about it. > A few days later we went to Yosemite and then the Grand Canyon, both of > which he talked about at length (very favorably). I share your sentiments. As do my wife and I. the last time we went, my wife commented that she would have liked to hear just one person say "F--- you." I will not discuss going on Space Mountain stoned. OTOH I really enjoyed EPCOT, I went with some business associates who got us some kind of VIP pass. We never waited in line for anything.. -- Peter
From: Peter on 3 Jul 2010 21:40 "tony cooper" <tony_cooper213(a)earthlink.net> wrote in message news:gckv26hcpmdqpkcmjc21a8e6rg586ov0in(a)4ax.com... > On Sat, 3 Jul 2010 12:59:54 -0700, Savageduck > <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote: > >>Been there, done that. That was a long time ago, I didn't buy the >>Tee-shirt, or the ears. That was only because an overseas visitor >>wanted the experience. From my point of view, money wasted, a perfect >>example of ugly American artificiality and corporate greed. I am not >>impressed with, and I don't like what Disneyland/World is selling. >>Give me the National Parks, Yosemite, Zion, Sequoia-Kings Canyon, the >>Redwoods, Adirondacks, Death Valley, or Big Sur for real "fun" and >>America. >>...but that is not you is it? > > I have only been to Disney World (Orlando's park) with small children > in tow. I didn't pay any attention to the plasticity or the > artificialness of the place because I was watching the absolute, pure > joy of the kids. What you call "corporate greed" is what I call an > exchange of value for money. Every time I've been to Disney with the > kids the value of the good time they had was more than the money I > exchanged for the day. > > In most of the national parks you mention, corporate greed displaced > the native peoples who originally inhabited that area. We have > Yosemite because greedy gold miners discovered the area, the railroad > barons opened up travel to that area, and California troops (the > Mariposa Battalion) cleaned out the Miwoks, the Chowchillas, and the > Ahwahneechee Indians. > > It was a Savage - James Savage - who led the Mariposa Battalion. He > was a gold miner who wanted the Indians out because they bothered his > greedy plans to take gold from the Merced River. > We have treated the native American people in a disgustingly shameful manner. Technically there is a lot of land that has been stolen from them, in addition to those lands we forced them to cede at the point of a gun. Now many tribes are using land claims as a lever to extract gaming rights. How sad to see the rich culture of these people so reduced. -- Peter
From: John McWilliams on 3 Jul 2010 22:19 Peter wrote: > "Allen" <allent(a)austin.rr.com> wrote in message > news:RPydnUmwG-5LO7LRnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d(a)giganews.com... >> Savageduck wrote: >> <snip> >>> Been there, done that. That was a long time ago, I didn't buy the >>> Tee-shirt, or the ears. That was only because an overseas visitor >>> wanted the experience. From my point of view, money wasted, a perfect >>> example of ugly American artificiality and corporate greed. I am not >>> impressed with, and I don't like what Disneyland/World is selling. >>> Give me the National Parks, Yosemite, Zion, Sequoia-Kings Canyon, the >>> Redwoods, Adirondacks, Death Valley, or Big Sur for real "fun" and >>> America. >>> ...but that is not you is it? >>> >> <snip> >> Sounds like my son. He went to Disneyland when he was seven years old. >> Looked around at a lot of things. When he left he said to his mother >> "Everything in there is plastic". That's the only thing he said about >> it. A few days later we went to Yosemite and then the Grand Canyon, >> both of which he talked about at length (very favorably). I share your >> sentiments. > > > As do my wife and I. the last time we went, my wife commented that she > would have liked to hear just one person say "F--- you." I will not > discuss going on Space Mountain stoned. My wife never liked to hear that. What a wonderful wife you have! > > OTOH I really enjoyed EPCOT, I went with some business associates who > got us some kind of VIP pass. We never waited in line for anything.. Same here, though didn't wait 'cause it was brand new. First Imax I saw, and it was hot air balloons rising over a few different chateaux, with St. Saens' organ concerto blasting from all sides. Son et lumiere in FLA!. What a treat. -- john mcwilliams
From: John McWilliams on 3 Jul 2010 22:21 Peter wrote: > "tony cooper" <tony_cooper213(a)earthlink.net> wrote in message > news:gckv26hcpmdqpkcmjc21a8e6rg586ov0in(a)4ax.com... >> On Sat, 3 Jul 2010 12:59:54 -0700, Savageduck >> <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote: >> >>> Been there, done that. That was a long time ago, I didn't buy the >>> Tee-shirt, or the ears. That was only because an overseas visitor >>> wanted the experience. From my point of view, money wasted, a perfect >>> example of ugly American artificiality and corporate greed. I am not >>> impressed with, and I don't like what Disneyland/World is selling. >>> Give me the National Parks, Yosemite, Zion, Sequoia-Kings Canyon, the >>> Redwoods, Adirondacks, Death Valley, or Big Sur for real "fun" and >>> America. >>> ...but that is not you is it? >> >> I have only been to Disney World (Orlando's park) with small children >> in tow. I didn't pay any attention to the plasticity or the >> artificialness of the place because I was watching the absolute, pure >> joy of the kids. What you call "corporate greed" is what I call an >> exchange of value for money. Every time I've been to Disney with the >> kids the value of the good time they had was more than the money I >> exchanged for the day. >> >> In most of the national parks you mention, corporate greed displaced >> the native peoples who originally inhabited that area. We have >> Yosemite because greedy gold miners discovered the area, the railroad >> barons opened up travel to that area, and California troops (the >> Mariposa Battalion) cleaned out the Miwoks, the Chowchillas, and the >> Ahwahneechee Indians. >> >> It was a Savage - James Savage - who led the Mariposa Battalion. He >> was a gold miner who wanted the Indians out because they bothered his >> greedy plans to take gold from the Merced River. >> > > > We have treated the native American people in a disgustingly shameful > manner. Technically there is a lot of land that has been stolen from > them, in addition to those lands we forced them to cede at the point of > a gun. Now many tribes are using land claims as a lever to extract > gaming rights. How sad to see the rich culture of these people so reduced. Indeed. "Progress". I don't know of a single piece of land discovered by any nation and then occupied by them where it was much different. There must be some, somewhere, and I'd like to hear about them. -- John McWilliams
From: Peter on 3 Jul 2010 22:34
"John McWilliams" <jpmcw(a)comcast.net> wrote in message news:i0or2n$r16$2(a)news.eternal-september.org... > Peter wrote: >> "Allen" <allent(a)austin.rr.com> wrote in message >> news:RPydnUmwG-5LO7LRnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d(a)giganews.com... >>> Savageduck wrote: >>> <snip> >>>> Been there, done that. That was a long time ago, I didn't buy the >>>> Tee-shirt, or the ears. That was only because an overseas visitor >>>> wanted the experience. From my point of view, money wasted, a perfect >>>> example of ugly American artificiality and corporate greed. I am not >>>> impressed with, and I don't like what Disneyland/World is selling. >>>> Give me the National Parks, Yosemite, Zion, Sequoia-Kings Canyon, the >>>> Redwoods, Adirondacks, Death Valley, or Big Sur for real "fun" and >>>> America. >>>> ...but that is not you is it? >>>> >>> <snip> >>> Sounds like my son. He went to Disneyland when he was seven years old. >>> Looked around at a lot of things. When he left he said to his mother >>> "Everything in there is plastic". That's the only thing he said about >>> it. A few days later we went to Yosemite and then the Grand Canyon, both >>> of which he talked about at length (very favorably). I share your >>> sentiments. >> >> >> As do my wife and I. the last time we went, my wife commented that she >> would have liked to hear just one person say "F--- you." I will not >> discuss going on Space Mountain stoned. > > My wife never liked to hear that. What a wonderful wife you have! Thank you. Like me she grew up as a street from NYC and both of us call thigs pretty much as we see them. She always had a sense of humor. (she once shot a cop with a water pistol.) though the dumbest thing she ever did as stick with me all these years. When we met she was just 15. this year will be our 50th anniversy. We plan to go the the Panama Canal to celebrate. -- Peter |