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From: Duncan Kennedy on 5 Feb 2010 05:52
In message <cgzjmthpzs-EA030B.09195205022010(a)news.simnet.is>, Martin-S
<cgzjmthpzs(a)lzrpqi.net> writes
>In article <hkgnhk$uq9$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>,
> chris <ithinkiam(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I still think it's a huge waste of money to get schools to pay for
>> somthing like Contribute on a per-seat basis when once the website has
>> been created any cheap/free tool can be used to update it.
>
>As far as I recall Contribute is used to update *static* web sites as
>opposed to dynamic ones, that run off a CMS.
>
>Moving a large static site into a CMS can be quite a job. Depending on
>how many authors there are and how often the site gets updated, it might
>still be worth it.
>
I agree entirely with that - Joomla is fine if you are using a dynamic
construction with a database but Contribute is intended for static
sites.

I've used it as a test - in preparation for writing a Noddy book for a
client taking it up - and it seems to work well. I've also gone through
the Garrick Chow training on the www.lynda.com site (OK I got a free 30
days when I bought a new copy of Dreamweaver 4 for the Mac) I found the
course excellent - fully illustrated with videos but at 99GBP on DVD it
would be expensive.

I doubt very much if you could attempt to *set up a site using
Contribute - it is intended to permit an administrator to permit
different people / groups access to selected parts of the site while
others can amend everything that is marked (in Dreamweaver) as editable.

For the future, Adobe seems to be developing an on-line editing which
*appears to use their servers - InContext Editing. There is an on line
trial on their site somewhere and its use is / was currently free but
only available in the US. The last time I looked there was a lot of
noise about the forecast charges Adobe would make for a minimum of 5 (?)
sites although the license holder could allocate the client licenses to
different site owners.

--
Duncan K
Downtown Dalgety Bay
From: Duncan Kennedy on 5 Feb 2010 05:58
In message <hkgqmv$75l$2(a)news.eternal-september.org>, chris
<ithinkiam(a)gmail.com> writes
>On 05/02/2010 09:51, Geoff Berrow wrote:
>> On Fri, 5 Feb 2010 07:40:46 +0000, Chris Ridd<chrisridd(a)mac.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>> CMSs are so well developed these days (Drupal, Joomla) it would take a
>>>> pretty compelling argument to make me want to spend good money on
>>>> achieving the same thing
>>>
>>> The websites for our local schools are all hosted on our local
>>> education authority's server. There might be significant limits on what
>>> your school can run on a shared server.
>>
>> Yeah, good point. As a former IT teacher I should have remembered
>> that.
>>
>> Spoiled by the real world and my own VPS, me.
>>
>> Contribute, despite the cost, may well prove to be the simplest
>> option.
>
>The cost is what is worrying me most, in these times of tight budgets.
>Apparently, there is a yearly, /per seat/, licence cost. I don't get
>where that is coming from?
>
Adobe education discounts are very good. On the other hand NVU /
KompoZer is a full WYSIWYG Dreamweaver style application and it is free
- if you can persuade the LA to let you run it (been there with a local
Primary School - builders now repairing head shaped hole in wall.)

--
Duncan K
Downtown Dalgety Bay
From: chris on 5 Feb 2010 06:59
On 05/02/2010 10:52, Duncan Kennedy wrote:
> In message <cgzjmthpzs-EA030B.09195205022010(a)news.simnet.is>, Martin-S
> <cgzjmthpzs(a)lzrpqi.net> writes
>> In article <hkgnhk$uq9$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>,
>> chris <ithinkiam(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I still think it's a huge waste of money to get schools to pay for
>>> somthing like Contribute on a per-seat basis when once the website has
>>> been created any cheap/free tool can be used to update it.
>>
>> As far as I recall Contribute is used to update *static* web sites as
>> opposed to dynamic ones, that run off a CMS.
>>
>> Moving a large static site into a CMS can be quite a job. Depending on
>> how many authors there are and how often the site gets updated, it might
>> still be worth it.
>>
> I agree entirely with that - Joomla is fine if you are using a dynamic
> construction with a database but Contribute is intended for static sites.

OK

> I've used it as a test - in preparation for writing a Noddy book for a
> client taking it up - and it seems to work well. I've also gone through
> the Garrick Chow training on the www.lynda.com site (OK I got a free 30
> days when I bought a new copy of Dreamweaver 4 for the Mac) I found the
> course excellent - fully illustrated with videos but at 99GBP on DVD it
> would be expensive.

Useful link thanks. Just reading through the contents of the Contribute
tutorial gives an insight to what it can and can't do.

> I doubt very much if you could attempt to *set up a site using
> Contribute - it is intended to permit an administrator to permit
> different people / groups access to selected parts of the site while
> others can amend everything that is marked (in Dreamweaver) as editable.

That sounds pretty powerful, but it's only defined by markup in the
HTML. Anyone with access by other means can still edit whatever they
want (like via Nvu as you mention), can't they?

Does this mean there's a Contribute server somewhere that manages the
edit permissions?
From: Duncan Kennedy on 5 Feb 2010 09:30
In message <hkh17s$ful$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, chris
<ithinkiam(a)gmail.com> writes
>
>
>> I doubt very much if you could attempt to *set up a site using
>> Contribute - it is intended to permit an administrator to permit
>> different people / groups access to selected parts of the site while
>> others can amend everything that is marked (in Dreamweaver) as editable.
>
>That sounds pretty powerful, but it's only defined by markup in the
>HTML. Anyone with access by other means can still edit whatever they
>want (like via Nvu as you mention), can't they?

Yes - I update many sites for clients but, during the test, I gave them
permission to set up restrictions so that their own HQ web editors (ie
those who wrote the content) could edit any of the 5 or 6 "Editable
Regions" I wrote in while one or two senior staff in remote offices
could edit certain pages only.
>
>Does this mean there's a Contribute server somewhere that manages the
>edit permissions?

No - each "Editable Region" (set up using Templates) has an individual
ID and a "Key" I set up within my copy of Contribute and supplied on a
memory stick permits the person(s) with Admin authority to apply
passwords / IDs to others to give them partial access. Each copy of
Contribute accesses the client's own web server (in this case a virtual
server with an ISP)

I emphasise that this was a trial run and although everything went to
plan, it is still a few weeks away from going live. I'm hoping I
remember what I did in the Garrick Chow tutorial as I don't have a
Lynda.com account and don't want to part with 100 quid for the DVD.
There is some free guidance on the web but Contribute itself (CS3 in
this case) seems short of a Manual.


--
Duncan K
Downtown Dalgety Bay
From: Steve Firth on 5 Feb 2010 11:42
chris <ithinkiam(a)gmail.com> wrote:

> Do you have any experience of implementing Joomla or
> similar?

Joomla and Sharepoint. I used Joomla to create a company website with an
e-Business shopping cart using Zen cart. Obviously you won't need that.

It's most a piece of cake. The easy way is to buy a suitable template
for your site (they are quite cheap) or use one of the free ones or, as
I did, create your own - which takes "quite a bit" of work, but is very
rewarding to do if you like that sort of thing.

Sadly the site no longer exists, but I've been meaning to create some
more and to do my own company web portal using Joomla.

There are some nice third part applications to install into Joomla. I
used one to provide a picture gallery. You can also create various types
of role (Administrators, Editors, Content Providers etc). It's also
possible to do tricks like have content available to all and content
available only to subscribers on the same page.

It would work well for a community/collaborative site. For example at
the school you could nominate some trustworthy individuals as editors
(moderators) to review, approve and publish content. Give others the
rights to publish their own content without being subject to editorial
control and permit parents to be able to create contributions which will
only be published after moderation.

I've also used and adminsitrated Sharepoint sites. Compared to Joomla
Sharepoint is pretty poor.
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