Complex page numbering in documents?
in [UK Mac]
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From: Jaimie Vandenbergh on 17 May 2010 09:48 On Mon, 17 May 2010 14:33:49 +0100, peter(a)cara.demon.co.uk (Peter Ceresole) wrote: >Andy Hewitt <thewildrover(a)me.com> wrote: > >> Well, I've kind of worked it out now. The attributes that apply to a >> section break apply to the text *before* it, and not after it, which is >> how I'd been trying to make it work. > >Gosh. > >Does this mean that you are supposed to read Word docs backwards? Or is >it all in reverse Polish notation? > >Very weird. Normal for Word. The way the .doc file format (mostly!) works is backwards, just like this. Quite insane. Mind you, I've got a doc on the go at the moment that insists on spacing some paragraphs at 2 rather than the 1.5 all the other lines of the same style are at. Seems to be something about para's at the top of a page, since if you pad the text out enough they go back to 1.5. I played with it for half an hour and gave up. It doesn't look all that bad. Cheers - Jaimie -- If you can't measure it, it's not science.
From: Andy Hewitt on 17 May 2010 10:19 Peter Ceresole <peter(a)cara.demon.co.uk> wrote: > Andy Hewitt <thewildrover(a)me.com> wrote: > > > Well, I've kind of worked it out now. The attributes that apply to a > > section break apply to the text *before* it, and not after it, which is > > how I'd been trying to make it work. > > Gosh. > > Does this mean that you are supposed to read Word docs backwards? Or is > it all in reverse Polish notation? > > Very weird. Weird indeed. I know MS like to create their own 'standards', but this does seem a bit extreme! -- Andy Hewitt <http://web.me.com/andrewhewitt1/>
From: Graham J on 17 May 2010 10:46 "Andy Hewitt" <thewildrover(a)me.com> wrote in message news:1jin2z4.31ck0h14gqb05N%thewildrover(a)me.com... > Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote: > >> On 2010-05-17 11:38:41 +0100, Richard Tobin said: >> >> > In article <1jilyne.pl0vq8yxuc7pN%thewildrover(a)me.com>, >> > Andy Hewitt <thewildrover(a)me.com> wrote: >> > >> >>> Why does it have to be one file? >> > >> >> I believe that's the format that's required for this work. >> > >> > [...] >> > >> >> Besides, I think the work has to be submitted as a Word file (this is >> >> back to our wonderful educational system again, even the private >> >> sector >> >> is working the same way). >> > >> > If it's required to be done that way, presumably all the other students >> > will be having the same problem. >> >> Perhaps making Word work properly is the real exercise? Seems a bit >> cruel of them... > > Well, I've kind of worked it out now. The attributes that apply to a > section break apply to the text *before* it, and not after it, which is > how I'd been trying to make it work. This was only made clear in > "Bending Word to Your Will", and was hilighted in bold, so thanks for > that Chris. On the face of it, that would seem reasonable. At the beginning of the document, select the first section, and apply the attributes you require. At the desired point, insert the "section break". So text after the break can now have different attributes. The attributes are applied to the text, not to the section break. On a more general point, it's normally necessary to select some text before one can apply any attributes to it. This seems to be something that novice users really do have difficulty with - they want to specify the attributes, then later apply the attributes to the text. -- Graham J
From: Peter Ceresole on 17 May 2010 11:07 Jaimie Vandenbergh <jaimie(a)sometimes.sessile.org> wrote: > Normal for Word. The way the .doc file format (mostly!) works is > backwards, just like this. Oh well. Anne edited the Decorative Arts Society mag once (she chairs the society now) and everybody except me (I use Pages and NeoOffice, so I sort out the horrors that sometimes arise) communicates with Word attachments. It kinda works except now that docx files have raised their ugly heads; Pages handles them fine, so I have taken to converting the docxs to docs and rebroadcasting them. I did try for a while to get those with the new versions of Word to 'Save as' doc files, to make things easier for everybody who couldn't afford to pay the M$ tax, or couldn't conceive of getting the free converter. No good. These are clever people. And yet... One of them submitted an article for publication; she has a PhD in her subject and must have committed a truckload of Word files. She submitted one that looked perfect, except that the whole thing was hard coded. Hard spaces, hard page breaks, footnotes that were correctly set out except that the placing was hard, and the indents were spaces... I know this person well, she is extremely intelligent and superbly organised. I'd trust her with anything... So do her students. But sorting out that article was *interesting*. But it did take less time than entering a couple that were submitted in handwriting on lined paper. But this was from a former V&A curator, who'd been around a long time and didn't use a computer. Anyway, her article was so interesting that actually enjoyed typing it in. -- Peter
From: Graham J on 17 May 2010 12:33
[snip] > > These are clever people. And yet... One of them submitted an article for > publication; she has a PhD in her subject and must have committed a > truckload of Word files. She submitted one that looked perfect, except > that the whole thing was hard coded. Hard spaces, hard page breaks, > footnotes that were correctly set out except that the placing was hard, > and the indents were spaces... I know this person well, she is extremely > intelligent and superbly organised. I'd trust her with anything... So do > her students. But sorting out that article was *interesting*. I've struggled to teach apparently hightly intelligent people to use Word formatting. The problem is, that if you want something unusual (non-sequential bullet points, numeric bullet point on lines by themselves, some very specific layouts, indentation that aligns with tabs, numbers in columns that line up on their decimal points regardless of precision, etc.) then those with perseverance will finally discover that they can completely disable all the M$ automatic formatting and will hard code everything in a monospaced font. In truth, what most people actually want is a typewriter that allows correction. It lets them concentate on the document itself, rather than them having to learn how to use any sort of tool. -- Graham J |