I think it's time for a brand new O/S
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From: AgentFriday on 23 Mar 2010 07:09 Rudolf Harras wrote: > >So I think making a new application or game might be more useful than a >new OS. Well, consider this... If neat stuff can be done on a C64 as is, imagine what could be done if you had as much memory to work with as you wanted, an internet connection, and a rich set of run-time calls you could take advantage of. What if you could do more than one thing at a time without rebooting, switching between them as you wish. Go back and forth between your favorite sprite editor and native compiler. Maybe even be able to shut down to play a game, then pick up right where you left off? One big problem is, what do you support -- an REU, a GeoRAM, or something else like a RAMLink or an in-box job that provides 16K banks? Because each one takes some work, and if you don't support them all, you've seriously limited the number of folks who can see your neat thing at work. For almost every enhancement or solution done for the '64, it is almost a law that says someone else did it some other way, that may very well be incompatible. Even if everyone could acquire all of these nifty hardware and software solutions, many extinct, few could afford it. So people just work with what they have. So I say, the more people there are to see the neat things, the more people will be doing them. And the more cool things there are to see, the bigger the crowd. Not to mention, I think there's a level of creativity that is sorely underrepresented. There are those that have the aptitude and desire to get down to the bare bones and do something from scratch. There are many others who aren't great at that, but they are wizards at the high level. What if they were able to "plug and play" different C-64 technologies in order to create even more useful and cool works at the macro level? I'm not saying those people aren't active out there, but how mane people are there who have the right equipment to appreciate their work? That, my friends, is what my O/S concept is all about. There is so much untapped creativity among Commodore hobbiests, I want to see some more of it come to life. // Steve AgentFriday <my_nic_here(a)hotmail.com>
From: AgentFriday on 23 Mar 2010 07:11 Michael <mistermsk(a)gmail.com> wrote: >Which is why you use a REU. The 1541U has a 16Meg REU on it. I use a >512k REU with my MMC replay. When viewing webpages, it is like using >the good old Unix/Linux program Lynx. Its down and dirty and removed >pictures. It more of, can I do it, then everyday use, though. Which >how most feel about the Commodore, besides playing games of course. Michael, I'm curious what environment / software do you use for browsing? AgentFriday <my_nic_here(a)hotmail.com>
From: christianlott1 on 24 Mar 2010 16:15 On Mar 23, 6:09 am, AgentFriday <my_nic_h...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > Rudolf Harras wrote: > > >So I think making a new application or game might be more useful than a > >new OS. > > Well, consider this... If neat stuff can be done on a > C64 as is, imagine what could be done if you had as > much memory to work with as you wanted, an internet > connection, and a rich set of run-time calls you could > take advantage of. What if you could do more than > one thing at a time without rebooting, switching > between them as you wish. Go back and forth between > your favorite sprite editor and native compiler. Maybe > even be able to shut down to play a game, then pick > up right where you left off? With an internet connection, whats the purpose of having all of the local memory? Why not server accounts on a local or remote pc? This way most of your operating system is server code replying to the C64 client. Suddenly you can have a huge and complex operating system with a tiny client-side footprint. Not too many people have a nic card right now though. Probably because it doesnt have that one killer app that everyone wants. That killer app is probably a simple but feature rich server app for the pc, something with a browser interface. I wanted to make something like this with the rs232 but it just wasnt fast enough. Being able to disguise an http/ftp server as drive 8 would also be useful. As well, the C64 doesn't need a dedicated nic if there's a pc nearby, a usb interface would do.
From: AgentFriday on 25 Mar 2010 04:07
On Mar 24,christianlott1 <christianlott1(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > With an internet connection, whats the purpose of > having all of the local memory? Why not server > accounts on a local or remote pc? You might be able to come very close to a RAM-RAM transfer loop by using net-based storage (which includes GeoRAM). And that relies on a very spefic set of requirements that might not even be possible outside of my brain. <g> Remote server account? Now there's an interesting idea. > This way most of your operating system is server code > replying to the C64 client. Suddenly you can have a > huge and complex operating system with a tiny client- > side footprint. I do commodore projects by a certain code. If a design goes too far astray from what would have been possible back in the day, then it seems to me that's it's not so much of a "C64 project", or enhancement, but more of an exercise in turning a perfectly good little computer into a dumb terminal. (It's not quite that simple, but you get the idea.) The commodore needs to stay in the driver's seat. Of course, you have to bend the rules every now and then. > Not too many people have a nic card right now though. > Probably because it doesnt have that one killer app ... Perhaps also because it's not all that cheap. Then, yeah, is it worth it with the few applications avail. that can exploit it. I haven't researched it myself, but I've been told that the overhead it takes to talk TCP/IP are both memory and compute intensive, which would limit throughput. I'm not sure how broadly that applies. > I wanted to make something like this with the rs232 > but it just wasnt fast enough. Being able to disguise > an http/ftp server as drive 8 would also be useful. 2400 baud is slower than the stock 1541 (whch is about equiv. to 5600). But it's been livable for now. I'll have 38.4 going once I get a couple days for debugging. (38.4 beats fastloaders, not sure if that's true for Jiffy- DOS.) Does anybody have a fairly good idea of the minimum outlay neededd to get a 64 onto the net? I've seen two or three, but I'm not up on what's out there. Stay tuned... there's some cool things on the way. :0) AgentFriday <my_nic_here(a)hotmail.com> |