SR/GR use absolute time to synchronize the GPS clocks with the ground clock.
in [Physics]
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From: Sam Wormley on 21 Mar 2010 14:31 On 3/21/10 9:54 AM, kenseto wrote: > On Mar 21, 10:46 am, Sam Wormley<sworml...(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> On 3/21/10 9:06 AM, kenseto wrote: >> >>> Hey idiot....you are describing a doppler(sic) situation. It got nothing to >>> do with the sychronization(sic) of two relatively moving clocks. >> >>> Ken Seto >> >> Why, pray tell, do you think one can ignore Doppler effects >> when measuring signals from moving clocks? > > Hey idiot because the rate of the GPS clock compared to the ground > clock is not doppler effect dependent. Pulsars are affected by Doppler shift, as are interplanetary probes, global navigation satellite systems (GNSS) and any clock in radial motion with respect to an observer. Give us a break, Seto!
From: Michael Moroney on 21 Mar 2010 23:31 kenseto <kenseto(a)erinet.com> writes: >On Mar 20, 9:57=A0pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) >wrote: >> Hey, fool. A crazy musician composes his musical masterpiece where one of >> the "instruments" is a train horn. =A0The audience, on a train platform, = >is >> supposed to hear the horn at the tone of "A" above Middle C (which is 440 >> Hz BTW). =A0The train will approach the station at 60 mph. >Hey idiot....you are describing a doppler situation. It got nothing to >do with the sychronization of two relatively moving clocks. So, idiot, why do you dismiss a perceived frequency shift due to the Doppler Effect as just the Doppler Effect and ignore the composer's effort to compensate for the Doppler Effect as trivial, yet you come up with kookiness such as "redefinition of the second" when the designers of the GPS system had the foresight to compensate for the frequency shift of special and general relativity? All the GPS designers did was the very same thing the composer did, to compensate for a physical effect that changes the frequency due to ordinary physics.
From: kenseto on 22 Mar 2010 09:55 On Mar 21, 11:31 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) wrote: > kenseto <kens...(a)erinet.com> writes: > >On Mar 20, 9:57=A0pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) > >wrote: > >> Hey, fool. A crazy musician composes his musical masterpiece where one of > >> the "instruments" is a train horn. =A0The audience, on a train platform, = > >is > >> supposed to hear the horn at the tone of "A" above Middle C (which is 440 > >> Hz BTW). =A0The train will approach the station at 60 mph. > >Hey idiot....you are describing a doppler situation. It got nothing to > >do with the sychronization of two relatively moving clocks. > > So, idiot, why do you dismiss a perceived frequency shift due to the > Doppler Effect as just the Doppler Effect and ignore the composer's effort > to compensate for the Doppler Effect as trivial, yet you come up with > kookiness such as "redefinition of the second" when the designers of > the GPS system had the foresight to compensate for the frequency shift > of special and general relativity? All the GPS designers did was the > very same thing the composer did, to compensate for a physical effect that > changes the frequency due to ordinary physics. Hey idiot....the rate of a clock moving wrt you does not change because it move away from you or move toward you. Accoridng to SR its rate is 1/gamma at all times. The rate of the GPS clock does not change....the redefined GPS second is designed to make the the GPS clock run at the same rate as the ground clock in terms of absolute time. Ken Seto
From: kenseto on 22 Mar 2010 10:01 On Mar 21, 2:31 pm, Sam Wormley <sworml...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 3/21/10 9:54 AM, kenseto wrote: > > > On Mar 21, 10:46 am, Sam Wormley<sworml...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> On 3/21/10 9:06 AM, kenseto wrote: > > >>> Hey idiot....you are describing a doppler(sic) situation. It got nothing to > >>> do with the sychronization(sic) of two relatively moving clocks. > > >>> Ken Seto > > >> Why, pray tell, do you think one can ignore Doppler effects > >> when measuring signals from moving clocks? > > > Hey idiot because the rate of the GPS clock compared to the ground > > clock is not doppler effect dependent. > > Pulsars are affected by Doppler shift, as are interplanetary probes, > global navigation satellite systems (GNSS) and any clock in radial > motion with respect to an observer. Give us a break, Seto! Hey wormy use your tiny brain once in a while. The rate of a clock moving wrt you does not change because it move toward you or away from you. According to SR the rate of a clock moving wrt you is 1/gamma at all time. Ken Seto
From: Michael Moroney on 22 Mar 2010 12:46
kenseto <kenseto(a)erinet.com> writes: >On Mar 21, 11:31 pm, moro...(a)world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) >wrote: >> So, idiot, why do you dismiss a perceived frequency shift due to the >> Doppler Effect as just the Doppler Effect and ignore the composer's effort >> to compensate for the Doppler Effect as trivial, yet you come up with >> kookiness such as "redefinition of the second" when the designers of >> the GPS system had the foresight to compensate for the frequency shift >> of special and general relativity? All the GPS designers did was the >> very same thing the composer did, to compensate for a physical effect that >> changes the frequency due to ordinary physics. >Hey idiot....the rate of a clock moving wrt you does not change >because it move away from you or move toward you. Accoridng to SR its >rate is 1/gamma at all times. Just like the frequency of the horn on the train does not change just because it is approaching the audience on the train platform. The audience hears the desired tone, 440 Hz. Passengers on the train hear a lower tone, the tone the horn was designed for. GPS receivers receive the proper signal frequency on the ground. Anyone riding a GPS satellite will detect a different frequency, the frequency preselected so that the target audience, users near/on the ground, will receive the proper frequency. There is *no* difference between the train example and the GPS system, other than the source of the frequency shift (Doppler vs. SR/GR). Both systems preadjusted the frequency so that the target audience will receive the correct frequency. That is all. |