Wonderful!
in [Physics]
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From: mpc755 on 19 Dec 2009 23:39 On Dec 19, 10:24 pm, glird <gl...(a)aol.com> wrote: > On Dec 19, 8:53 pm, mpc755 wrote:> On Dec 19, 4:31 pm, glird wrote: > >< Contrary to my expectation that nothing would happen to clocks at rest inside a closed chamber in which THE LOCAL MEDIUM (air) WAS AT > > REST, the clock flown in the same direction as Earth's surface moves > ran slowest, the one flown in the opposite direction ran fastest, and > the third one's rate was somewhere in between. > [snip] > So, mpc, how do YOU explain the Pan Am experiment? > > > > > >< The Pan Am flights are flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the Earth. > > > Slow down, mpc, and think a bit longer before replying. If both Pan > Am planes were flying (at identical speeds) through a medium at rest > to earth, then how come they didn't both slow down identically > relative to a clock that remained stationary on the ground? > Do not consider the aether to be entrained by the Earth. The aether is entrained by the Earth. The aether moves with respect to the Earth's rotation. The plane flying east to west is facing an aether 'headwind' while the plane flying west to east an aether 'tailwind'. The plane flying east to west is flying 'against' the aether while the plane flying west to east is flying 'with' the aether. > ><http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson%E2%80%93Morley_experiment > > "If the Earth is traveling through an ether medium, a beam reflecting > back and forth parallel to the flow of ether would take longer than a > beam reflecting perpendicular to the ether because the time gained > from traveling downwind is less than that lost traveling upwind." > > > Right answer; wrong reason. {The downwind time for a ray to travel > x = 1 unit of distance > would be x/(c+v) and the upwind time would be > x/(c-v), so if v = .8c it would take 5/9 second for the downwind time > and 5 seconds for the upwind time; so -- because it would take 1 > second each way if the medium and Earth co-moved, the time gained from > traveling downwind IS less than that lost traveling upwind. That, > however, isn't WHY a beam reflecting back and forth would take longer > than a beam reflecting perpendicularly.) > > >< When the atomic clock {is} on the Pan Am flight east to west it is flying against the entrained aether and when it is flying west to east it is flying with the entrained aether. > > > I see you DID slow down and reconsider your reply. Please pardon my > prior instantaneous remark after you said, "The Pan Am flights are > flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the > Earth." > > ><The downwind and upwind effect is going to have a greater effect on the atom's oscillations when flying against the entrained aether. > > > What's that have to do with the expectation that the total two-way > time, downwind + upwind, would take longer than the total two-way time > perpendicularly? > Nothing. Perpendicular is in the quote having to do with the MMX experiment. > >< This means the effects of aether, even though being displaced by the plane, must still be going through the plane. The reason momentum can be conserved even with aether flowing through matter is the same as the reason momentum is conserved by the Earth. > > > I woke up this morning thinking, "Mpc seems to be thinking exactly > what I was 55 years ago, when the voice in the middle of my head said, > 'Jerry! Let matter be compressible'." > (I'd been trying to figure out the mechanism of gravity; and was > thinking in terms of a universally stationary ether made of > infinitesimally small INcompressible bits through which ponderable > atomic matter flew at various velocities. Given the brand new basic > premise -- which ultimately canceled the kinetic-atomic-theory that > ALL matter is made of ultimate particles seperated by empty spaces -- > it took only about another 2 months for me to figure out the mechanism > of gravity.) > Anyway, this morning's thinking continued thus: "I wonder if mpc's > mind, which is human like mine, would process that novel premise in > the same or a similar way that mine did. I think i will post this new > premise in one of my replies to his messages." > So, although i'd posted it before, including where I got this > "extraterrestrial" premise, here it is again. > > MPC! LET THE AETHER BE COMPRESSIBLE. > I think what you want is the property of 'density' to be applied to the aether. What does aether 'density' get you that aether 'pressure' does not? > glird > > > Matter displaces the > > aether. The displaced aether pushes back. The interaction of a moving > > object with the aether is frictionless, or the friction is negligible. > > This occurs for the nuclei of atoms just as it does for the Earth itself. > > GLIRD! USE GOGGLE GROUPS!
From: mpc755 on 20 Dec 2009 00:05 On Dec 19, 11:39 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Dec 19, 10:24 pm, glird <gl...(a)aol.com> wrote: > > > > > On Dec 19, 8:53 pm, mpc755 wrote:> On Dec 19, 4:31 pm, glird wrote: > > >< Contrary to my expectation that nothing would happen to clocks at rest inside a closed chamber in which THE LOCAL MEDIUM (air) WAS AT > > > REST, the clock flown in the same direction as Earth's surface moves > > ran slowest, the one flown in the opposite direction ran fastest, and > > the third one's rate was somewhere in between. > > [snip] > > So, mpc, how do YOU explain the Pan Am experiment? > > > > >< The Pan Am flights are flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the Earth. > > > > Slow down, mpc, and think a bit longer before replying. If both Pan > > Am planes were flying (at identical speeds) through a medium at rest > > to earth, then how come they didn't both slow down identically > > relative to a clock that remained stationary on the ground? > > Do not consider the aether to be entrained by the Earth. The aether is > entrained by the Earth. The aether moves with respect to the Earth's > rotation. The plane flying east to west is facing an aether 'headwind' > while the plane flying west to east an aether 'tailwind'. The plane > flying east to west is flying 'against' the aether while the plane > flying west to east is flying 'with' the aether. > > > > > ><http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson%E2%80%93Morley_experiment > > > "If the Earth is traveling through an ether medium, a beam reflecting > > back and forth parallel to the flow of ether would take longer than a > > beam reflecting perpendicular to the ether because the time gained > > from traveling downwind is less than that lost traveling upwind." > > > > Right answer; wrong reason. {The downwind time for a ray to travel > > x = 1 unit of distance > > would be x/(c+v) and the upwind time would be > > x/(c-v), so if v = .8c it would take 5/9 second for the downwind time > > and 5 seconds for the upwind time; so -- because it would take 1 > > second each way if the medium and Earth co-moved, the time gained from > > traveling downwind IS less than that lost traveling upwind. That, > > however, isn't WHY a beam reflecting back and forth would take longer > > than a beam reflecting perpendicularly.) > > > >< When the atomic clock {is} on the Pan Am flight east to west it is flying against the entrained aether and when it is flying west to east it is flying with the entrained aether. > > > > I see you DID slow down and reconsider your reply. Please pardon my > > prior instantaneous remark after you said, "The Pan Am flights are > > flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the > > Earth." > > > ><The downwind and upwind effect is going to have a greater effect on the atom's oscillations when flying against the entrained aether. > > > > What's that have to do with the expectation that the total two-way > > time, downwind + upwind, would take longer than the total two-way time > > perpendicularly? > > Nothing. Perpendicular is in the quote having to do with the MMX > experiment. > > > > > >< This means the effects of aether, even though being displaced by the plane, must still be going through the plane. The reason momentum can be conserved even with aether flowing through matter is the same as the reason momentum is conserved by the Earth. > > > > I woke up this morning thinking, "Mpc seems to be thinking exactly > > what I was 55 years ago, when the voice in the middle of my head said, > > 'Jerry! Let matter be compressible'." > > (I'd been trying to figure out the mechanism of gravity; and was > > thinking in terms of a universally stationary ether made of > > infinitesimally small INcompressible bits through which ponderable > > atomic matter flew at various velocities. Given the brand new basic > > premise -- which ultimately canceled the kinetic-atomic-theory that > > ALL matter is made of ultimate particles seperated by empty spaces -- > > it took only about another 2 months for me to figure out the mechanism > > of gravity.) > > Anyway, this morning's thinking continued thus: "I wonder if mpc's > > mind, which is human like mine, would process that novel premise in > > the same or a similar way that mine did. I think i will post this new > > premise in one of my replies to his messages." > > So, although i'd posted it before, including where I got this > > "extraterrestrial" premise, here it is again. > > > MPC! LET THE AETHER BE COMPRESSIBLE. > > I think what you want is the property of 'density' to be applied to > the aether. What does aether 'density' get you that aether 'pressure' > does not? > > > glird > > > > Matter displaces the > > > aether. The displaced aether pushes back. The interaction of a moving > > > object with the aether is frictionless, or the friction is negligible.. > > > This occurs for the nuclei of atoms just as it does for the Earth itself. > > GLIRD! USE GOGGLE GROUPS! I think I have it backwards on the 'headwind' and 'tailwind'. The entrained aether 'lags' the Earth's rotation. This means the plane flying west to east has the 'headwind' because it has to fly through more aether. The plane flying east to west has the 'tailwind' because it is flying with the lagging aether relative to the Earth. Let's say the aether 'connected' to the surface of the Earth lags the Earth's rotation at the equator by 1 mile every 24 hours. Let's also say a plane takes 24 hours to fly around the Earth at the equator. A plane flying west to east will travel through 2 miles more aether than a plane flying east to west.
From: mpc755 on 20 Dec 2009 07:52 On Dec 20, 12:05 am, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Dec 19, 11:39 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Dec 19, 10:24 pm, glird <gl...(a)aol.com> wrote: > > > > On Dec 19, 8:53 pm, mpc755 wrote:> On Dec 19, 4:31 pm, glird wrote: > > > >< Contrary to my expectation that nothing would happen to clocks at rest inside a closed chamber in which THE LOCAL MEDIUM (air) WAS AT > > > > REST, the clock flown in the same direction as Earth's surface moves > > > ran slowest, the one flown in the opposite direction ran fastest, and > > > the third one's rate was somewhere in between. > > > [snip] > > > So, mpc, how do YOU explain the Pan Am experiment? > > > > > >< The Pan Am flights are flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the Earth. > > > > > Slow down, mpc, and think a bit longer before replying. If both Pan > > > Am planes were flying (at identical speeds) through a medium at rest > > > to earth, then how come they didn't both slow down identically > > > relative to a clock that remained stationary on the ground? > > > Do not consider the aether to be entrained by the Earth. The aether is > > entrained by the Earth. The aether moves with respect to the Earth's > > rotation. The plane flying east to west is facing an aether 'headwind' > > while the plane flying west to east an aether 'tailwind'. The plane > > flying east to west is flying 'against' the aether while the plane > > flying west to east is flying 'with' the aether. > > > > ><http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson%E2%80%93Morley_experiment > > > > "If the Earth is traveling through an ether medium, a beam reflecting > > > back and forth parallel to the flow of ether would take longer than a > > > beam reflecting perpendicular to the ether because the time gained > > > from traveling downwind is less than that lost traveling upwind." > > > > > Right answer; wrong reason. {The downwind time for a ray to travel > > > x = 1 unit of distance > > > would be x/(c+v) and the upwind time would be > > > x/(c-v), so if v = .8c it would take 5/9 second for the downwind time > > > and 5 seconds for the upwind time; so -- because it would take 1 > > > second each way if the medium and Earth co-moved, the time gained from > > > traveling downwind IS less than that lost traveling upwind. That, > > > however, isn't WHY a beam reflecting back and forth would take longer > > > than a beam reflecting perpendicularly.) > > > > >< When the atomic clock {is} on the Pan Am flight east to west it is flying against the entrained aether and when it is flying west to east it is flying with the entrained aether. > > > > > I see you DID slow down and reconsider your reply. Please pardon my > > > prior instantaneous remark after you said, "The Pan Am flights are > > > flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the > > > Earth." > > > > ><The downwind and upwind effect is going to have a greater effect on the atom's oscillations when flying against the entrained aether. > > > > > What's that have to do with the expectation that the total two-way > > > time, downwind + upwind, would take longer than the total two-way time > > > perpendicularly? > > > Nothing. Perpendicular is in the quote having to do with the MMX > > experiment. > > > > >< This means the effects of aether, even though being displaced by the plane, must still be going through the plane. The reason momentum can be conserved even with aether flowing through matter is the same as the reason momentum is conserved by the Earth. > > > > > I woke up this morning thinking, "Mpc seems to be thinking exactly > > > what I was 55 years ago, when the voice in the middle of my head said, > > > 'Jerry! Let matter be compressible'." > > > (I'd been trying to figure out the mechanism of gravity; and was > > > thinking in terms of a universally stationary ether made of > > > infinitesimally small INcompressible bits through which ponderable > > > atomic matter flew at various velocities. Given the brand new basic > > > premise -- which ultimately canceled the kinetic-atomic-theory that > > > ALL matter is made of ultimate particles seperated by empty spaces -- > > > it took only about another 2 months for me to figure out the mechanism > > > of gravity.) > > > Anyway, this morning's thinking continued thus: "I wonder if mpc's > > > mind, which is human like mine, would process that novel premise in > > > the same or a similar way that mine did. I think i will post this new > > > premise in one of my replies to his messages." > > > So, although i'd posted it before, including where I got this > > > "extraterrestrial" premise, here it is again. > > > > MPC! LET THE AETHER BE COMPRESSIBLE. > > > I think what you want is the property of 'density' to be applied to > > the aether. What does aether 'density' get you that aether 'pressure' > > does not? > > > > glird > > > > > Matter displaces the > > > > aether. The displaced aether pushes back. The interaction of a moving > > > > object with the aether is frictionless, or the friction is negligible. > > > > This occurs for the nuclei of atoms just as it does for the Earth itself. > > > GLIRD! USE GOGGLE GROUPS! > > I think I have it backwards on the 'headwind' and 'tailwind'. The > entrained aether 'lags' the Earth's rotation. This means the plane > flying west to east has the 'headwind' because it has to fly through > more aether. The plane flying east to west has the 'tailwind' because > it is flying with the lagging aether relative to the Earth. > > Let's say the aether 'connected' to the surface of the Earth lags the > Earth's rotation at the equator by 1 mile every 24 hours. Let's also > say a plane takes 24 hours to fly around the Earth at the equator. A > plane flying west to east will travel through 2 miles more aether than > a plane flying east to west. Clocks 'tick' at different rates based on aether pressure.
From: mpc755 on 20 Dec 2009 13:13 On Dec 20, 7:52 am, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Dec 20, 12:05 am, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Dec 19, 11:39 pm, mpc755 <mpc...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Dec 19, 10:24 pm, glird <gl...(a)aol.com> wrote: > > > > > On Dec 19, 8:53 pm, mpc755 wrote:> On Dec 19, 4:31 pm, glird wrote: > > > > >< Contrary to my expectation that nothing would happen to clocks at rest inside a closed chamber in which THE LOCAL MEDIUM (air) WAS AT > > > > > REST, the clock flown in the same direction as Earth's surface moves > > > > ran slowest, the one flown in the opposite direction ran fastest, and > > > > the third one's rate was somewhere in between. > > > > [snip] > > > > So, mpc, how do YOU explain the Pan Am experiment? > > > > > > >< The Pan Am flights are flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the Earth. > > > > > > Slow down, mpc, and think a bit longer before replying. If both Pan > > > > Am planes were flying (at identical speeds) through a medium at rest > > > > to earth, then how come they didn't both slow down identically > > > > relative to a clock that remained stationary on the ground? > > > > Do not consider the aether to be entrained by the Earth. The aether is > > > entrained by the Earth. The aether moves with respect to the Earth's > > > rotation. The plane flying east to west is facing an aether 'headwind' > > > while the plane flying west to east an aether 'tailwind'. The plane > > > flying east to west is flying 'against' the aether while the plane > > > flying west to east is flying 'with' the aether. > > > > > ><http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson%E2%80%93Morley_experiment > > > > > "If the Earth is traveling through an ether medium, a beam reflecting > > > > back and forth parallel to the flow of ether would take longer than a > > > > beam reflecting perpendicular to the ether because the time gained > > > > from traveling downwind is less than that lost traveling upwind." > > > > > > Right answer; wrong reason. {The downwind time for a ray to travel > > > > x = 1 unit of distance > > > > would be x/(c+v) and the upwind time would be > > > > x/(c-v), so if v = .8c it would take 5/9 second for the downwind time > > > > and 5 seconds for the upwind time; so -- because it would take 1 > > > > second each way if the medium and Earth co-moved, the time gained from > > > > traveling downwind IS less than that lost traveling upwind. That, > > > > however, isn't WHY a beam reflecting back and forth would take longer > > > > than a beam reflecting perpendicularly.) > > > > > >< When the atomic clock {is} on the Pan Am flight east to west it is flying against the entrained aether and when it is flying west to east it is flying with the entrained aether. > > > > > > I see you DID slow down and reconsider your reply. Please pardon my > > > > prior instantaneous remark after you said, "The Pan Am flights are > > > > flying in both directions against the aether which is entrained by the > > > > Earth." > > > > > ><The downwind and upwind effect is going to have a greater effect on the atom's oscillations when flying against the entrained aether. > > > > > > What's that have to do with the expectation that the total two-way > > > > time, downwind + upwind, would take longer than the total two-way time > > > > perpendicularly? > > > > Nothing. Perpendicular is in the quote having to do with the MMX > > > experiment. > > > > > >< This means the effects of aether, even though being displaced by the plane, must still be going through the plane. The reason momentum can be conserved even with aether flowing through matter is the same as the reason momentum is conserved by the Earth. > > > > > > I woke up this morning thinking, "Mpc seems to be thinking exactly > > > > what I was 55 years ago, when the voice in the middle of my head said, > > > > 'Jerry! Let matter be compressible'." > > > > (I'd been trying to figure out the mechanism of gravity; and was > > > > thinking in terms of a universally stationary ether made of > > > > infinitesimally small INcompressible bits through which ponderable > > > > atomic matter flew at various velocities. Given the brand new basic > > > > premise -- which ultimately canceled the kinetic-atomic-theory that > > > > ALL matter is made of ultimate particles seperated by empty spaces -- > > > > it took only about another 2 months for me to figure out the mechanism > > > > of gravity.) > > > > Anyway, this morning's thinking continued thus: "I wonder if mpc's > > > > mind, which is human like mine, would process that novel premise in > > > > the same or a similar way that mine did. I think i will post this new > > > > premise in one of my replies to his messages." > > > > So, although i'd posted it before, including where I got this > > > > "extraterrestrial" premise, here it is again. > > > > > MPC! LET THE AETHER BE COMPRESSIBLE. > > > > I think what you want is the property of 'density' to be applied to > > > the aether. What does aether 'density' get you that aether 'pressure' > > > does not? > > > > > glird > > > > > > Matter displaces the > > > > > aether. The displaced aether pushes back. The interaction of a moving > > > > > object with the aether is frictionless, or the friction is negligible. > > > > > This occurs for the nuclei of atoms just as it does for the Earth itself. > > > > GLIRD! USE GOGGLE GROUPS! > > > I think I have it backwards on the 'headwind' and 'tailwind'. The > > entrained aether 'lags' the Earth's rotation. This means the plane > > flying west to east has the 'headwind' because it has to fly through > > more aether. The plane flying east to west has the 'tailwind' because > > it is flying with the lagging aether relative to the Earth. > > > Let's say the aether 'connected' to the surface of the Earth lags the > > Earth's rotation at the equator by 1 mile every 24 hours. Let's also > > say a plane takes 24 hours to fly around the Earth at the equator. A > > plane flying west to east will travel through 2 miles more aether than > > a plane flying east to west. > > Clocks 'tick' at different rates based on aether pressure. The faster an atomic clock moves with respect to the aether, the more the aether exerts pressure on the atomic clock, the slower the clock 'ticks'. The greater the gravity, the more the aether exerts pressure on the atomic clock, the slower the clock 'ticks'. Gravity is aether pressure.
From: glird on 20 Dec 2009 14:21
On Dec 19, 11:39 pm, mpc755 wrote: >< Do not consider the aether to be entrained by the Earth. The aether is entrained by the Earth. The aether moves with respect to the Earth's rotation. > >> MPC! LET THE AETHER BE COMPRESSIBLE. > > I think what you want is the > property of 'density' to be applied > to the aether. No, mpc. Actually, for several decades ending around 2008, I used the word "dinsity" to denote a quantity of ether per cc. Why? Because "density" means "mass/cc" and in my oldish terms, "raw undifferentiated non- particulate etheric matter has no mass". Why did I change from "dinsity" to "density" wrt etheric matter? For the reason I'd hoped to provide after you answered my "(misleadingly) 'simple'" question, How do you measure a quantity of matter? (I expected you or someone else to answer, "You weigh it." Instead, you said, "The quantity of matter is determined by the amount of displaced aether. I know this is not what you are looking for but the amount of aether matter displaces is mass.") If, as you said, mass is the amount of {incompressible?} aether that matter displaces, then "mass" would be restricted to aether. Given your reply to my question "How do you measure a quantity of aether?" I will ask it another way: If A=Mc^2 denotes a quantity of aether, how would you MEASURE it in order to find the value of A in a given case? glird > What does aether 'density' get you > that aether 'pressure' does not? |