...and it's gone again
in [UK Mac]
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From: Sak Wathanasin on 28 Sep 2006 06:48 Jaimie Vandenbergh wrote: > No, Ian is evidence. Not statistically significant evidence, > certainly. Not according to my dictionary: evidence is a) something that furnishes proof, b) something legally submitted to a tribunal to ascertain the truth of a matter. Ian's experiences, while providing an interesting data-point, fails both of these tests. They clearly show that there is something wrong with *Ian's* MBP, but to extrapolate this to a claim of "there is a design flaw in all MBPs" is a sweeping generalization of the worse kind. -- Sak Wathanasin Network Analysis Limited http://www.network-analysis.ltd.uk
From: Kit on 28 Sep 2006 08:45 In article <91b.451ba86b.6b973(a)newshost.network-analysis.ltd.uk>, Sak Wathanasin <sw(a)nan.co.uk> wrote: > Not according to my dictionary: evidence is a) something that furnishes > proof, Without wishing to get involved in the particular case of the MSB, I should point out that you need to get a better dictionary. Not only does it not differentiate between an item of evidence and a body (i.e. several items) of evidence, it also simplifies so much that it is misleading. An individual piece of evidence *may* furnish proof *sometimes* but in fact even a whole body of evidence does not always furnish proof. Consider a trial where many items of evidence are presented that even taken together may not (in the opinion of the jury) act as proof. Also bear in mind that it depends on what sort of thing one is trying to prove. As expounded by Popper, one observation (i.e. a piece of evidence) may prove a hypothesis wrong but even many observations may not prove a hypothesis is correct. e.g. One might have hypothesised that "all swans are white". For centuries thousands of observations in Europe would have apparently confirmed that. Then Europeans went to Australia and seeing just one black swan would prove the hypothesis to be wrong. A single piece of evidence is only proof of itself. Seeing a white swan merely proves that the individual swan is white. A fingerprint at the scene of a crime (i.e. one piece of evidence) merely shows that a fingerprint was found. Even if another piece of evidence shows that the print belonged to a particular person it does not prove the person committed the crime. Indeed, it does not on its own prove the person was even at the scene of the crime. Maybe the item with the print was carried there or someone else transfered the print there to frame the person in question. Just because one explanation is much more likely than the others does not *prove* that the most likely explanation is true. Thus I hope that you can agree that the definition above is so oversimplified that it is misleading and therefore makes that dictionary suspect. Kit
From: zoara on 28 Sep 2006 09:03 On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 13:45:44 +0100, Kit wrote: > One might have hypothesised that "all > swans are white". For centuries thousands of observations in Europe > would have apparently confirmed that. Then Europeans went to Australia > and seeing just one black swan would prove the hypothesis to be wrong. That is a wonderful demonstrative (and even poetic?) example. I'll remember it for future use. -z- -- iPod killer, coming zune.
From: Kit on 28 Sep 2006 09:18 In article <e45i0vgs8i3o.1r0d2cwkdefho$.dlg(a)40tude.net>, zoara <me3(a)privacy.net> wrote: > On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 13:45:44 +0100, Kit wrote: > > > One might have hypothesised that "all > > swans are white". For centuries thousands of observations in Europe > > would have apparently confirmed that. Then Europeans went to Australia > > and seeing just one black swan would prove the hypothesis to be wrong. > > That is a wonderful demonstrative (and even poetic?) example. I'll remember > it for future use. Not originally mine though... I believe it was first used by Karl Popper. Kit
From: zoara on 28 Sep 2006 11:08
On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 14:18:43 +0100, Kit wrote: > In article <e45i0vgs8i3o.1r0d2cwkdefho$.dlg(a)40tude.net>, zoara > <me3(a)privacy.net> wrote: > >> On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 13:45:44 +0100, Kit wrote: >> >>> One might have hypothesised that "all >>> swans are white". For centuries thousands of observations in Europe >>> would have apparently confirmed that. Then Europeans went to Australia >>> and seeing just one black swan would prove the hypothesis to be wrong. >> >> That is a wonderful demonstrative (and even poetic?) example. I'll remember >> it for future use. > > Not originally mine though... > I believe it was first used by Karl Popper. Still nice, and still appreciated... -z- -- iPod killer, coming zune. |