Jihad needs scientists
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From: mmeron on 17 Dec 2006 19:34 In article <1h0h54-2kb.ln1(a)sirius.tg00suus7038.net>, The Ghost In The Machine <ewill(a)sirius.tg00suus7038.net> writes: >In sci.physics, Eeyore ><rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> > wrote >on Sun, 17 Dec 2006 22:45:09 +0000 ><4585C875.DCD9A857(a)hotmail.com>: >> >> >> The Ghost In The Machine wrote: >> >>> In sci.physics, John Fields <jfields(a)austininstruments.com> wrote >>> > >>> > As long as the ice is floating the water level will never change. >>> > However, if you fill the glass with enough ice so that the column >>> > sinks to, and is supported by the bottom of the glass, then as the >>> > ice melts the water level will rise until the column of ice no >>> > longer touches the bottom of the glass. >>> >>> I should point out that a floating ice cube is less dense >>> than the water bouying it; therefore, as it melts, the total >>> volume of ice + water will lessen. What that does to water >>> level in, say, a tank of water with free floating ice, >>> I'm not entirely certain. >> >> And you call yourself a scientist ? >> >> How about doing some basic science and see for yourself ? >> >> Graham >> > >As it so happens I do have a cup with a good amount of ice in it; I'll >fill it to the brim with tap water and then wait a few hours and see how >the level goes. > >It's the best I can do without more sophisticated equipment. :-) In >any event my computations suggest that no change should ensue in the >water level. > >That covers prediction and experimental setup. Results...well, we'll >just have to wait. > It is an elementary problem. The mass of the ice cube is equal to the mass of the water it displaces (Archimedes). After melting, it'll fill the volume it displaces. The level *will not* change. Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool, meron(a)cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
From: JoeBloe on 17 Dec 2006 19:47 On Sun, 17 Dec 2006 14:09:41 -0800, The Ghost In The Machine <ewill(a)sirius.tg00suus7038.net> Gave us: >I should point out that a floating ice cube is less dense >than the water bouying it; But it still equilibrates. The amount of water it displaces diminishes as it melts as well, so the water line of the tank, glass, etc. remains exactly what it would read the moment the ice was introduced.
From: JoeBloe on 17 Dec 2006 19:50 On Sun, 17 Dec 2006 23:40:18 +0000, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> Gave us: >It's astonishing you even feel the need to do it. But heck, why not ? I can't believe that you stab at him for lack of scientific observation, then attempt to chide him here for doing one. You are beyond hypocrite, ASSWIPE.
From: JoeBloe on 17 Dec 2006 19:55 On Mon, 18 Dec 2006 00:34:14 GMT, mmeron(a)cars3.uchicago.edu Gave us: >In article <1h0h54-2kb.ln1(a)sirius.tg00suus7038.net>, The Ghost In The Machine <ewill(a)sirius.tg00suus7038.net> writes: >>In sci.physics, Eeyore >><rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> >> wrote >>on Sun, 17 Dec 2006 22:45:09 +0000 >><4585C875.DCD9A857(a)hotmail.com>: >>> >>> >>> The Ghost In The Machine wrote: >>> >>>> In sci.physics, John Fields <jfields(a)austininstruments.com> wrote >>>> > >>>> > As long as the ice is floating the water level will never change. >>>> > However, if you fill the glass with enough ice so that the column >>>> > sinks to, and is supported by the bottom of the glass, then as the >>>> > ice melts the water level will rise until the column of ice no >>>> > longer touches the bottom of the glass. >>>> >>>> I should point out that a floating ice cube is less dense >>>> than the water bouying it; therefore, as it melts, the total >>>> volume of ice + water will lessen. What that does to water >>>> level in, say, a tank of water with free floating ice, >>>> I'm not entirely certain. >>> >>> And you call yourself a scientist ? >>> >>> How about doing some basic science and see for yourself ? >>> >>> Graham >>> >> >>As it so happens I do have a cup with a good amount of ice in it; I'll >>fill it to the brim with tap water and then wait a few hours and see how >>the level goes. >> >>It's the best I can do without more sophisticated equipment. :-) In >>any event my computations suggest that no change should ensue in the >>water level. >> >>That covers prediction and experimental setup. Results...well, we'll >>just have to wait. >> >It is an elementary problem. The mass of the ice cube is equal to the >mass of the water it displaces (Archimedes). After melting, it'll >fill the volume it displaces. The level *will not* change. > >Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool, >meron(a)cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same" However, as John stated, IF the ice column of ice in the container stacks all the way to the base of the vessel, ANY ICE above the water line is NOT buoyed up, and will add to the water line height as the ice recedes into the container. The moment the ice free floats again, the ice above the water line no longer adds to that level.
From: The Ghost In The Machine on 17 Dec 2006 19:32
In sci.physics, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote on Sun, 17 Dec 2006 23:40:18 +0000 <4585D562.F0F334A8(a)hotmail.com>: > > > The Ghost In The Machine wrote: > >> In sci.physics, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote >> > The Ghost In The Machine wrote: >> >> In sci.physics, John Fields <jfields(a)austininstruments.com> wrote >> >> > >> >> > As long as the ice is floating the water level will never change. >> >> > However, if you fill the glass with enough ice so that the column >> >> > sinks to, and is supported by the bottom of the glass, then as the >> >> > ice melts the water level will rise until the column of ice no >> >> > longer touches the bottom of the glass. >> >> >> >> I should point out that a floating ice cube is less dense >> >> than the water bouying it; therefore, as it melts, the total >> >> volume of ice + water will lessen. What that does to water >> >> level in, say, a tank of water with free floating ice, >> >> I'm not entirely certain. >> > >> > And you call yourself a scientist ? >> > >> > How about doing some basic science and see for yourself ? >> > >> > Graham >> >> As it so happens I do have a cup with a good amount of ice in it; I'll >> fill it to the brim with tap water and then wait a few hours and see how >> the level goes. >> >> It's the best I can do without more sophisticated equipment. :-) In >> any event my computations suggest that no change should ensue in the >> water level. >> >> That covers prediction and experimental setup. Results...well, we'll >> just have to wait. > > It's astonishing you even feel the need to do it. But heck, why not ? > > Good luck anyway. I'd stick it in a microwave oven to get it over with quickly > but that's just me and the 'greens' would probably say that the government > microwave rays gave a flawed result so you'd better not do that after all ! An interesting point, but microwaves will heat the water and thus distort the experiment somewhat. :-) (Greens or otherwise.) Ideally, I'd cover the cup with a transparent dome but don't have one handy. > > Graham > -- #191, ewill3(a)earthlink.net Useless C++ Programming Idea #11823822: signal(SIGKILL, catchkill); -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |