From: Jim on 2 Jul 2010 10:01 On 2010-07-02, zoara <me18(a)privacy.net> wrote: >>> >>> I'm proud too, though less so. http://j.mp/bNLckT >>> The annual UCSM post-pub fight is always fun. See you again next >> > year! >>> >>> (despite what I said on Facebook, they look worse today than in that >>> photo; at least I no longer look like I've spilled tomato sauce all >> > over >>> my face. Find it amusing that almost nobody at work has asked what's >>> happened). >> >> er...what -did- happen? > > A friend and I were heading back from the pub (hint, this probably had > something to do with it) on our bikes. I misjudged the steepness of a > stream's banks, thinking at the speed I was going at my front wheel > would hit the opposite bank head on (it was actually shallow enough that > I wouldn't have got any air anyway). Braked hard and landed literally > face-first in the dirt. > > It hurt, but could have been a lot worse. [trying not to grin like a loon][*nearly* succeeding] Jim -- Twitter:@GreyAreaUK "If you have enough book space, I don't want to talk to you." Terry Pratchett
From: Rowland McDonnell on 2 Jul 2010 14:57 Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote: > Jochem Huhmann said: > > > real-not-anti-spam-address(a)apple-juice.co.uk (D.M. Procida) writes: > > > >> Jochem Huhmann <joh(a)gmx.net> wrote: > >> > >>>> Once information has gone into a PDF, it is just words, any structure it > >>>> has is completely lost. > >>>> > >>>> It is a purely display only format. > >>> > >>> There is tagged PDF though, which tries to address exactly this problem. > >> > >> PDF is basically built upon PostScript, a language intended to be > >> interpreted by laser printers. All it does it tell the device: make > >> such-and-such a mark here. > >> > >> It seems like the worst possible starting-point for trying to preserve > >> semantic content, never mind achieve accessibility. > > > > I'm certainly not advocating to use PDF as starting point for anything. > > PDF is almost always created from something else (which may very well > > have some structure in it) and if you have to create PDF anyway, a > > structured PDF is better than an unstructured PDF. > > The last time I tried creating tagged PDFs (from Framemaker) the > resulting files were massively bigger than untagged PDFs. Not all software is created equal... If I print to PDF from a PDF generated by pdfTeX, what MacOS X gives me is larger than the original and (I'm told) inferior in quality from the point of view of elegance and meeting required standards. Not that I can judge myself. > I'm not sure I've really seen any tagged PDFs in the wild. What do > Preview, iPhones/the iBooks app etc make of them? I dunno what a tagged pdf is really. But - somewhere - I have an RPN calculator done as a PDF file that certainly works with Acrobat Reader (not that I've used Acrobat Reader for years and years). But I can't track it down on the Web, and failed to track it down here (probably on a disc that's not mounted or something, gawd knows). Rowland. -- Remove the animal for email address: rowland.mcdonnell(a)dog.physics.org Sorry - the spam got to me http://www.mag-uk.org http://www.bmf.co.uk UK biker? Join MAG and the BMF and stop the Eurocrats banning biking
From: Rowland McDonnell on 2 Jul 2010 15:12 zoara <me18(a)privacy.net> wrote: > D.M. Procida <real-not-anti-spam-address(a)apple-juice.co.uk> wrote: [snip] > > What happened to your face though? > > What's wrong with my face? Overgrown eyebrows and a nose as bad as mine? - or was that just due to the wide angle lens? Rowland. -- Remove the animal for email address: rowland.mcdonnell(a)dog.physics.org Sorry - the spam got to me http://www.mag-uk.org http://www.bmf.co.uk UK biker? Join MAG and the BMF and stop the Eurocrats banning biking
From: Rowland McDonnell on 2 Jul 2010 15:15 Woody <usenet(a)alienrat.co.uk> wrote: > Jochem Huhmann wrote: > > usenet(a)alienrat.co.uk (Woody) writes: > > > >> A PDF can not be set up in such a way to let you know what a piece of > >> information means. > >> > >> Really at a basic level it is quite useless for structure. Even a table > >> is a collection of words with lines drawn in it - there isn't the > >> constructs inside a pdf to let the information within a table relate to > >> itself. > >> > >> Once information has gone into a PDF, it is just words, any structure it > >> has is completely lost. > >> > >> It is a purely display only format. > > > > There is tagged PDF though, which tries to address exactly this problem. > > I would say that it is really starting from the wrong end. Wouldn't it > be better to start with something else that had structure, and put the > display layout into it? Well, yes - PDF is an output format, after all. > You can embed full XML structures inside a PDF (or anything really, > videos, viruses, whatever), but is that not just trying to re-engineer > something to cope with something it was never designed (and contains no > structure) to do? I don't think so. > Effectively you would just have the information twice Well, yes, why not? Where's the problem with that? Mark up your input file with structure, use your PDF creator to generate a structured marked-up PDF, and Bob's yer auntie's live-in lover. Does a small amount of apparent data inefficiency matter, if indeed there is much? Rowland. -- Remove the animal for email address: rowland.mcdonnell(a)dog.physics.org Sorry - the spam got to me http://www.mag-uk.org http://www.bmf.co.uk UK biker? Join MAG and the BMF and stop the Eurocrats banning biking
From: zoara on 2 Jul 2010 15:51
Jim <jim(a)magrathea.plus.com> wrote: > On 2010-07-02, zoara <me18(a)privacy.net> wrote: >>>> >>>> I'm proud too, though less so. http://j.mp/bNLckT >>>> The annual UCSM post-pub fight is always fun. See you again next >>>> year! >>>> >>>> (despite what I said on Facebook, they look worse today than in > > > > that >>>> photo; at least I no longer look like I've spilled tomato sauce all >>>> over >>>> my face. Find it amusing that almost nobody at work has asked > > > > what's >>>> happened). >>> >>> er...what -did- happen? >> >> A friend and I were heading back from the pub (hint, this probably > > had >> something to do with it) on our bikes. I misjudged the steepness of a >> stream's banks, thinking at the speed I was going at my front wheel >> would hit the opposite bank head on (it was actually shallow enough > > that >> I wouldn't have got any air anyway). Braked hard and landed literally >> face-first in the dirt. >> >> It hurt, but could have been a lot worse. > > [trying not to grin like a loon][*nearly* succeeding] > > Jim About five minutes after it happened, I felt brilliant. Adrenaline is really cool. Feel bruised and battered now, though. -z- -- email: nettid1 at fastmail dot fm |