Memory Question
in [Windows 98]
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From: "MEB" meb@not on 12 Dec 2006 11:18 "Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM(a)myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote in message news:elmiu8$b1v$1(a)aioe.org... | "MEB" <meb(a)not real(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message | news:%23b8PZtfHHHA.3668(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... | | > Per Gary's and your discussion on memory vs. FSB verses video | > streaming | > verses ... | > | > Your limitations will likely be processor [Celeron at 500mhz] and its | > speed | > relationships [FSB at 66mhz], though memory MAY help... | | Thanks for the input, MEB; I had a feeling that might be the case. So I | guess even if I were to put in a faster Pentium III, the FSB would be | the bottleneck. | | -- | Dave | Well, maybe not. Look at you manual and see if it supports higher FSB speeds. Most boards of that time period would support 100mhz, though it might have been considered as "over-clocked' in that fashion. PER your manual: Support for Pentium-III/Pentium-II Cartridges or PPGA Celeron This mainboard support three kinds of Intel processors: Pentium-III cartridges, Pentium-II cartridges and SEPP or PPGA Celerons. Pentium- III cartridges feature 32K of internal level 1 cache memory and 512K of level-2 cache memory with improved instructions to handle 3D audio and video, speech recognition, MPEG2 motion picture encoding/decoding, and TCP/IP internet connections. The Pentium-III runs over a 100 MHz system bus and operates at clock speeds of 450 MHz, 500 MHz and 550 MHz. The Pentium-II cartridges are very powerful processors that include 32K of internal level-1 cache memory and 512K of external level-2 cache memory. The first generation of Pentium-II cartridges ran over a 66 MHz system bus, but current Pentium-II cartridges run over a 100 MHz system bus and operate at clock speeds from 350 MHz up to 450 MHz or more. The slot-1 processor can also be used by the SEPP Celeron processors which can operate over a 66/100 MHz system bus and operate at clock speeds up to 466 MHz. ---END So YOUR board can handle a complete change of processor and memory to at least 100mhz FSB. The issue will require re-setting Windows, and may cause fault errors [VMM and other problems], though they can sometimes be corrected. Expect that this will occur. With this complete change over, perhaps its time to consider a fresh install of 98. That is what I would recommend. Make sure though, that you have the most recent BIOS update installed BEFORE the change over, all drivers for the board, etc. ... see if any faster processors were added in the BIOS update [that general occurs over the life of the board], and perhaps consider MAXing out the PIII aspect per bios supported. The PIII coding WILL help, as will the increased FSB. ALL memory will have to be changed to the faster FSB, though that gives the opportunity to perfect match the memory modules. However, 1ghz or preferably faster processor speed would dramatically decrease your video issue since your running over DSL, though your board likely will not support that. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com/ BLOG http://peoplescounsel.spaces.live.com/ Public Notice or the "real world" "Most people, sometime in their lives, stumble across truth. Most jump up, brush themselves off, and hurry on about their business as if nothing had happen." Winston Churchill Or to put it another way: Morpheus can offer you the two pills; but only you can choose whether you take the red pill or the blue one. _______________
From: Daave on 12 Dec 2006 19:22 MEB wrote: > PER your manual: > > Support for Pentium-III/Pentium-II Cartridges or PPGA Celeron > This mainboard support three kinds of Intel processors: Pentium-III > cartridges, Pentium-II cartridges and SEPP or PPGA Celerons. Pentium- > III cartridges feature 32K of internal level 1 cache memory and 512K > of level-2 cache memory with improved instructions to handle 3D audio > and video, speech recognition, MPEG2 motion picture encoding/decoding, > and TCP/IP internet connections. The Pentium-III runs over a 100 MHz > system bus and operates at clock speeds of 450 MHz, 500 MHz and 550 > MHz. > The Pentium-II cartridges are very powerful processors that include > 32K > of internal level-1 cache memory and 512K of external level-2 cache > memory. The first generation of Pentium-II cartridges ran over a 66 > MHz system bus, but current Pentium-II cartridges run over a 100 MHz > system bus and operate at clock speeds from 350 MHz up to 450 MHz > or more. The slot-1 processor can also be used by the SEPP Celeron > processors which can operate over a 66/100 MHz system bus and > operate at clock speeds up to 466 MHz. > > ---END [snip] > However, 1ghz or preferably faster processor speed would dramatically > decrease your video issue since your running over DSL, though your > board likely will not support that. When the manual was printed, it appeared that 550 MHz was the upper limit for the processor. But I've come across other literature stating that it was 850 MHz. I would imagine you're correct about the board not being able to support 1 GHz or faster, but I wonder how I can get the definitive limit. I suppose I can contact their Support department (or as Gary said, an expert will chime in here!). I have a question about processors. Obviously if the processor speed is identical, a 512 KB L2 cache is preferable to a 256 one. However, it seems that the 512s tend to have slower speeds. So, how would a Pentium III 400 MHz processor with a 512 KB L2 cache compare with a Pentium III 800 MHz processor with a 256 KB L2 cache? -- Dave
From: "MEB" meb@not on 12 Dec 2006 20:40 "Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM(a)myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote in message news:2vmdnZlnbY7_2uLYnZ2dnUVZ_revnZ2d(a)cavtel.net... | MEB wrote: | > PER your manual: | > | > Support for Pentium-III/Pentium-II Cartridges or PPGA Celeron [mainboard support info cut] > | > ---END | [snip] | > However, 1ghz or preferably faster processor speed would dramatically | > decrease your video issue since your running over DSL, though your | > board likely will not support that. | | When the manual was printed, it appeared that 550 MHz was the upper | limit for the processor. But I've come across other literature stating | that it was 850 MHz. I would imagine you're correct about the board not | being able to support 1 GHz or faster, but I wonder how I can get the | definitive limit. I suppose I can contact their Support department (or | as Gary said, an expert will chime in here!). | | I have a question about processors. Obviously if the processor speed is | identical, a 512 KB L2 cache is preferable to a 256 one. However, it | seems that the 512s tend to have slower speeds. So, how would a Pentium | III 400 MHz processor with a 512 KB L2 cache compare with a Pentium III | 800 MHz processor with a 256 KB L2 cache? | | -- | Dave | | Start by looking for documentation pursuant the BIOS upgrades, should be somewhere on the site, and contain the issues fixed and additional processor support extended within. Per the "which is better" or "comparison analysis", the 3d gaming world (they did "Office" stuff comparisons too) would likely have the best info. However, per me, the 800mhz would be better. At twice the speed, cache isn't going to effect the speed enough to downgrade it to 400mhz. Moreover, the PIII contains additional "speed up" and other support code. Cost shouldn't matter much either, bought my present 733 PIII for $18.00 online [and on a BX board that means its over-clocked to 133mhz FSB, and if I ever run across a 1.2gig or a 1gig processor it will likely end up on the board as its fourth processor upgrade]. Such is the world of old computers and old OSs. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com/ BLOG http://peoplescounsel.spaces.live.com/ Public Notice or the "real world" "Most people, sometime in their lives, stumble across truth. Most jump up, brush themselves off, and hurry on about their business as if nothing had happen." Winston Churchill Or to put it another way: Morpheus can offer you the two pills; but only you can choose whether you take the red pill or the blue one. _______________
From: "MEB" meb on 12 Dec 2006 20:40 "Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM(a)myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote in message news:2vmdnZlnbY7_2uLYnZ2dnUVZ_revnZ2d(a)cavtel.net... | MEB wrote: | > PER your manual: | > | > Support for Pentium-III/Pentium-II Cartridges or PPGA Celeron [mainboard support info cut] > | > ---END | [snip] | > However, 1ghz or preferably faster processor speed would dramatically | > decrease your video issue since your running over DSL, though your | > board likely will not support that. | | When the manual was printed, it appeared that 550 MHz was the upper | limit for the processor. But I've come across other literature stating | that it was 850 MHz. I would imagine you're correct about the board not | being able to support 1 GHz or faster, but I wonder how I can get the | definitive limit. I suppose I can contact their Support department (or | as Gary said, an expert will chime in here!). | | I have a question about processors. Obviously if the processor speed is | identical, a 512 KB L2 cache is preferable to a 256 one. However, it | seems that the 512s tend to have slower speeds. So, how would a Pentium | III 400 MHz processor with a 512 KB L2 cache compare with a Pentium III | 800 MHz processor with a 256 KB L2 cache? | | -- | Dave | | Start by looking for documentation pursuant the BIOS upgrades, should be somewhere on the site, and contain the issues fixed and additional processor support extended within. Per the "which is better" or "comparison analysis", the 3d gaming world (they did "Office" stuff comparisons too) would likely have the best info. However, per me, the 800mhz would be better. At twice the speed, cache isn't going to effect the speed enough to downgrade it to 400mhz. Moreover, the PIII contains additional "speed up" and other support code. Cost shouldn't matter much either, bought my present 733 PIII for $18.00 online [and on a BX board that means its over-clocked to 133mhz FSB, and if I ever run across a 1.2gig or a 1gig processor it will likely end up on the board as its fourth processor upgrade]. Such is the world of old computers and old OSs. -- MEB http://peoplescounsel.orgfree.com/ BLOG http://peoplescounsel.spaces.live.com/ Public Notice or the "real world" "Most people, sometime in their lives, stumble across truth. Most jump up, brush themselves off, and hurry on about their business as if nothing had happen." Winston Churchill Or to put it another way: Morpheus can offer you the two pills; but only you can choose whether you take the red pill or the blue one. _______________
From: Daave on 14 Dec 2006 23:50
Gary S. Terhune wrote: > The standard way to judge whether you need more RAM is to use System > Monitor's "Swap file in use" monitoring. System Monitor is a System > Tool and usually needs to be installed via Add/Remove Programs => > Windows Components tab. If "swap file in use" consistently or even > just often measures more than 10 - 20 MB, then you could make good > use of more RAM. Make sure to give your system a good workout while > monitoring, leaving stuff open while you try other things, playiing a > video or listening to quality music while scrolling through a folder > full of images, or editing images with something like IrfanView, > creating an album of photos, etc. Thanks for the tip, Gary. I got that Swap File in Use up to around 50 MB by the way! But after I close all the memory-intensive apps, and the system returns to normal (not sputtering), why doesn't this value go back down? Also, can you explain the Processor Usage and Unused Physical Memory charts? -- Dave |