From: Vahis on 23 Feb 2010 04:57 On 2010-02-23, houghi <houghi(a)houghi.org.invalid> wrote: > Vahis wrote: >>> Then it is easy: don't fix it if it's broken. i.e. don't upgrade unless >>> you realy want to. ;-) >> >> I don't want to but I'll have to. >> openSUSE will be obsolete next summer. > > So you will follow the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" mantra anyway. > ;-) I always prefer that. But my openSUSE 11.0 is coming to EOL. After that I consider it broken (unsupported) I'm looking forward to rolling upgrades. I also think that if I go from 11.0 via zypper dup it's messy and uncertain as for result. So I won't try that. I have a separate sandbox running 11.3 MS2. With just LAMP functions. It works surprisingly well, I guess I'll put it on line within a few days and see how that'll go. > > If all that I wanted to do was run a VM, I would do a minimal install as > possible. See below for all on how I would do it. I have something similar in mind. > >>> I am not understanding what you want to know. >> >> I'd like to hear some Xen experience. > > Ah, OK, did not get that from your post. I thought so :) > I only once tried XEN. But that when it was added for the frst time and > I did not spend a lot of time with it. So perhaps you can do it in two > steps. > 1) See if XEN is something that you want to use, using openSUSE I think I will. I guess I'll put the milestone box on line for temporary replacement and start messing about with Xen. I'll need to do it on my main box anyway. My aim is to get rid of VMWare. I'd like mu SUSE as genuine as possible. > 2) See if SLES is something you want to use Knowing now the price makes me hesitate. > > Doing both steps in one go might result in failure for both. As I'll have the replacement running I can play around for a while. > SLES starts from 290EUR per year > http://www.novell.com/products/server/pricing_euro.html#getpricing > SLED 42EUR per year > http://www.novell.com/products/desktop/pricing_euro.html#getpricing SLES would be like 20 a month in a three year's contract. I spend so much on worse. But still... > > It could well be that SLED is all that you need. However it could also > be that XEN is not in that and thus won't be upgraded. SLED comes with Gnome. Not good. SLED may not have LAMP. That would be quite obvious. > >> Not other than Xen. It's a different story from VMWare. > > As I said, I would first go and try if XEN is what you want with > openSUSE. > > What I would do is first wait for 11.3 and do a new install with that. That looks like the most obvious solution. MS2 looks great and SLES just became quite pricey as I got the prices. > Use the time to figure out if XEN is the way to go. Then do a new > install with 11.3 (realease expected July 15th) on the following basis > if you have one HD of at least 100GB. I will also asume VirtalBox as I > have no experience with XEN, so I am not sure if it works with images as > well in the same way. > > X GB Swap (See whatever you want or like or think is needed) > 20 GB / (sda2) > 20 GB /empty (sda3) > All the rest on /VirtualManager > > As you can see no /home. The reason is that /home is not needed, because > all will be done in the VM. Now it could well be that you want some > extra partition for data that can also be reached from the VM, so all > will depend a lot on what you have. > > Now why the /empty ? When 12.0 comes out, you copy / to /empty. You add > /empty to grub. Reboot to /empty and do `zypper dup` I would think that > from 11.3 to 12.0 all will be working, but better save then sorry. > > Now if that works, you can make sda3 your new / and sda2 your new > /empty. Repeat with 12.0 to 12.1 > > And if "dup" does not work, you can do a new install. I would do an as > minimal install as possible. Only run what you need to be able to run > XEN. If possible that would mean not even X. > Thanks for your ideas :) Vahis -- "Sunrise 7:39am (EET), sunset 5:29pm (EET) at Espoo, FI (9:49 hours daylight)" http://waxborg.servepics.com Linux 2.6.25.20-0.6-default #1 SMP 2010-01-14 18:58:36 +0100 x86_64 11:22am up 3 days 3:51, 14 users, load average: 0.19, 0.20, 0.17
From: JT on 23 Feb 2010 05:05 On 23/02/10 10:43, houghi wrote: > David Bolt wrote: > >> You couldn't do it as a part of a cron job even if you wanted to. While >> you can upgrade using the DVD, or do fresh install, all without having >> to accept a license, you still need to do so to use zypper dup. Yes, >> there's a 15 month old bug[0] still open about it and, from the look of >> things, this will not be changed. >> > You just don't push hard enough. :-D > Well, as it is something that is required, then it should be possible to > simulate pressing the correct keys as well. > > houghi > Lazy here so I didn't read the bugreport, but doesn't the -n (--non-interactive) switch do the trick properly? -- Kind regards, JT
From: Eef Hartman on 23 Feb 2010 05:50 Vahis <waxborg(a)gmail.com.invalid> wrote: > As openSUSE 11.0 is approaching its EOL it makes me dream of longer life > My HW is from the summer before last, the SLES kernel (I think 2.6.27) > should pretty much cover it. > > SLES 11 should have like 6 years of life left? SLES (and SLED too) has 5 years of "full support" and 2 more of "security and bugfix patches", starting from march 2009 (I don't know the official release DATE, but it was in that month), so, yes, about 6 years left. > Anybody with experience of the above? We only use SLED at the moment here, and are having some problems with it (but that mostly isn't SLE's fault, just our strange setup). The BackOffice servers all run RHEL 5, which makes for some of those problems, the usage of MS ActiveDirectory (on Windows 2003 Servers!) is most of the rest of the problem (and yes, changing those is NOT an option, most of the uni is using Windows against those). -- ******************************************************************* ** Eef Hartman, Delft University of Technology, dept. SSC/ICT ** ** e-mail: E.J.M.Hartman(a)tudelft.nl - phone: +31-15-278 82525 ** *******************************************************************
From: Eef Hartman on 23 Feb 2010 05:53 houghi <houghi(a)houghi.org.invalid> wrote: > There should be no surprises for you as you already have a lot of SUSE > experience. SLES is from in time in between 11.0 and 11.1, I believe. Between 11.1 (released dec 2008) and 11.2 (nov 2009, yes, 11 months later!). So SLE is newer (mostly) then 11.1 and fixes most of the problems 11.1 had AT the release. -- ******************************************************************* ** Eef Hartman, Delft University of Technology, dept. SSC/ICT ** ** e-mail: E.J.M.Hartman(a)tudelft.nl - phone: +31-15-278 82525 ** *******************************************************************
From: David Bolt on 23 Feb 2010 08:32
On Tuesday 23 Feb 2010 12:05, while playing with a tin of spray paint, Shmuel Metz painted this mural: > > > In <20100223061806(a)usenet.waxborg.local>, on 02/23/2010 > at 04:51 AM, Vahis <waxborg(a)gmail.com.invalid> said: > >>I don't want to but I'll have to. >>openSUSE will be obsolete next summer. > > How does that force you to upgrade? If you aren't changing hardware, don't > need support and don't need new features then why can't you stay with what > you have until your situation changes? There is no reason for upgrading, unless you need the security updates or, as you say, change your hardware or need some new features. I still have a three systems running 10.3 just as well as they did when they were first installed, and another one that has been running 9.1 for years. That one will never receive an upgrade because it's unable to take more memory than the 160MB it already has, has no CD or DVD drive available to it, and can't boot from ethernet or USB. For the purpose it has ended up with, which is mainly to run syslogd and listen for remote log events, it's just fine. Although I might be able to shoehorn one of the 11.x releases onto it with some significant effort, it isn't worth that effort. It might be worth the effort if there's a drive failure at some point in the future, but it's more likely I'll just use one of my other machines instead. Regards, David Bolt -- Team Acorn: www.distributed.net OGR-NG @ ~100Mnodes RC5-72 @ ~1Mkeys/s openSUSE 11.0 32b | | | openSUSE 11.3M1 32b openSUSE 11.0 64b | openSUSE 11.1 64b | openSUSE 11.2 64b | TOS 4.02 | openSUSE 11.1 PPC | RISC OS 4.02 | RISC OS 3.11 |