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From: Jim on 13 Mar 2010 12:50
Ben Shimmin <bas(a)llamaselector.com> wrote:

> Mid-nineties. Only about seven people were interested, though. Everyone
> else was more interested in <MARQUEE> and <BLINK>.

MY EYES!

Jim
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From: Chris Ridd on 13 Mar 2010 13:19
On 2010-03-13 15:46:01 +0000, Adrian Tuddenham said:

> Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2010-03-13 13:01:54 +0000, Adrian Tuddenham said:
>>
>>> Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2010-03-13 09:19:02 +0000, Adrian Tuddenham said:
>>>>
>>>>> Until last night, Google worked perfectly well on all my browsers, this
>>>>> morning I find I have to turn off Javascript in iCab 3.0.5 to get it to
>>>>> work, although it will still work with Javascript switched on in iCab
>>>>> 2.9.9 and Mozilla 1.3.
>>>>>
>>>>> What have they changed?
>>>>
>>>> They recently dropped support for IE 6. Can you make your browsers
>>>> behave like something more recent?
>>>
>>> I've switched its identity from iCab to Netscape and now its working
>>> again (it also works as Opera). Why have they gone to the trouble to
>>> identify and exclude iCab?
>>
>> I doubt iCab even figures on their radar! There's probably some code
>> path that executes only when it "looks" like ancient versions of
>> Netscape, that allows iCab to work.
>
> Whatever happened to HTML and standardisation?

AIUI there's a reasonable number of things you just can't do in a
standard way. So they need to write in hacks for things that behave
like old browsers.

This is one of the reasons HTML 5 is being written.
--
Chris

From: Rowland McDonnell on 15 Mar 2010 01:01
Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote:

> Adrian Tuddenham said:
>
> > Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Adrian Tuddenham said:
> >>
> >>> Until last night, Google worked perfectly well on all my browsers, this
> >>> morning I find I have to turn off Javascript in iCab 3.0.5 to get it to
> >>> work, although it will still work with Javascript switched on in iCab
> >>> 2.9.9 and Mozilla 1.3.
> >>>
> >>> What have they changed?
> >>
> >> They recently dropped support for IE 6. Can you make your browsers
> >> behave like something more recent?
> >
> > I've switched its identity from iCab to Netscape and now its working
> > again (it also works as Opera). Why have they gone to the trouble to
> > identify and exclude iCab?
>
> I doubt iCab even figures on their radar!

Google sees all, Google knows all[1]. Of course Google knows about
iCab. Google might not /care/ about it, but it knows about it.

There can't be many operations supplying a Web browser in versions for
System 7.0.1-9.2.2, MacOS X 10.1-10.6, and iPhones - so that'll be three
OS platforms, and CPUs from 68k, 32 bit PPC, 64 bit PPC, 32 bit Intel,
to 64 bit Intel - and the Arm in the iPhone.

You think Google wouldn't be aware of something like that? Of course it
knows. Google is like the hundred-headed Hydra, looking in all
directions at once, seeing all, ignoring nothing.

Thankfully, it really doesn't have any evil designs. I know that
because we'd know about it by now if it did.

Given Google's intention to be all things to all people, and given that
it knows the world gets to it via Web browsers, I wouldn't be surprised
if Google actually tested using iCab.

Why not have an automated test suite, running automated tests on all the
Web browsers Google could get hold of? It'd pay off for a firm like
Google, I reckon. You don't have to make sure everything works on
everything, but you can ensure that almost everything works on almost
everything - and keeps working.

> There's probably some code
> path that executes only when it "looks" like ancient versions of
> Netscape, that allows iCab to work.

Sounded like the usual `Trouble with the fake ID' problem.

Rowland.

[1] Where `all' is defined as `the entire universe according to
Google': i.e., everything Google has read on the Web.

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From: Rowland McDonnell on 15 Mar 2010 01:01
Ben Shimmin <bas(a)llamaselector.com> wrote:

> zoara <me18(a)privacy.net>:
> > Adrian Tuddenham <adrian(a)poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> >> Whatever happened to HTML and standardisation?
> >
> > When did that ever happen? I certainly missed it if it did.
>
> Mid-nineties. Only about seven people were interested, though. Everyone
> else was more interested in <MARQUEE> and <BLINK>.

I wonder if that sort of thing has (mostly) gone away because so many
people just point blank wouldn't read the really atrocious Web pages?

Even that so-called `professional' white-on-black text that seems
popular with a certain kind of youngster puts me off.

Back when text was all we had and most monitors gave you white on black,
I thought everyone had learnt it made your eyes hurt if you stared at it
for ages, which is why green and amber monitors got used. Which I
liked.

Then Macs came out and I found that black on white text wasn't the same
sort of problem at all - so why do these idiots allegedly prefer white
on black text?

Rowland.

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From: Adrian Tuddenham on 19 Mar 2010 05:57
Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote:

> On 2010-03-13 13:01:54 +0000, Adrian Tuddenham said:
>
> > Chris Ridd <chrisridd(a)mac.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2010-03-13 09:19:02 +0000, Adrian Tuddenham said:
> >>
> >>> Until last night, Google worked perfectly well on all my browsers, this
> >>> morning I find I have to turn off Javascript in iCab 3.0.5 to get it to
> >>> work, although it will still work with Javascript switched on in iCab
> >>> 2.9.9 and Mozilla 1.3.
> >>>
> >>> What have they changed?
> >>
> >> They recently dropped support for IE 6. Can you make your browsers
> >> behave like something more recent?
> >
> > I've switched its identity from iCab to Netscape and now its working
> > again (it also works as Opera). Why have they gone to the trouble to
> > identify and exclude iCab?
>
> I doubt iCab even figures on their radar! There's probably some code
> path that executes only when it "looks" like ancient versions of
> Netscape, that allows iCab to work.


They've now stopped it from working on any settings so I have switched
to AltaVista.

It is interesting to find that I get fewer 'hits' but the relevant ones
seem to be higher up the list. It is a little slower, but not
agonisingly so.

--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk
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