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From: Arno Wagner on 20 Dec 2006 20:55
Previously ANTant(a)zimage.com wrote:
> In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage Arno Wagner <me(a)privacy.net> wrote:
>> Previously Paul Rubin <http://phr.cx(a)nospam.invalid> wrote:
>> > adykes(a)panix.com (Al Dykes) writes:
>> >> A third; only power the drive up when doing a backup ?
>> >> It won't get very hot, or for lots of hours.

>> > Backups involve having the drive very active for longish periods.
>> > That's what makes drives get hot, from what I can tell. I have a 3.5"
>> > 160gb Seagate 7200.x drive (not sure of exact model) in a generic usb2
>> > enclosure with a tiny fan. It runs cool when idling or slightly
>> > active even when I run it overnight. But doing a backup, it's quite
>> > warm after 10 minutes or so, and the backup takes much longer than
>> > that.

>> For short backups, it should be ok. For any longer activity, only
>> adequate cooling will work. Not that Seagates or Samsungs are quite
>> as sensitive to heat, but hot HDD are never good.

> Hmm, I guess I know why this HDD has problem. I *DID* use it as a
> regular drive. I didn't care how slow USB2 was. It was basically for
> playing back music, videos, copy VMware images, etc.

> I did notice this Maxtor USB HDD has one vent on the back. The case did
> get hot after a few hours.

There is your problem...

Arno
From: Arno Wagner on 20 Dec 2006 21:01
Previously Budd <Budd(a)budd.com> wrote:
> "Arno Wagner" <me(a)privacy.net> wrote in message news:4utd3aF19u82iU1(a)mid.individual.net
>> Previously Budd <Budd(a)budd.com> wrote:
>> > "Arno Wagner" <me(a)privacy.net> wrote in message news:4ustfuF19nrn9U2(a)mid.individual.net
>> > > Previously mike <spamme9(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > ANTant(a)zimage.com wrote:
>> > > > > Are there free programs like SpinRite that does well to do DEEP disk
>> > > > > checking/testings on external hard disk drives like Maxtor's USB (160
>> > > > > GB)? On two computers at work, I had it had it showed delay write
>> > > > > errors. Then, Windows lose connections and I have to repower off and on
>> > > > > to access the HDD again. I also tried different power and USB cables
>> > > > > since many people use the same HDD. Also, it is not heat beause
>> > > > > sometimes I get this problem after a few minutes after powering on from
>> > > > > room temperature (not warm either).
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Chkdsk /f /r did not report anything. I don't think it does testing
>> > > > > deep. Are there any tools that will do? I am trying HD Tune v2.52, but I
>> > > > > don't think that's enough. I need something like SpinRite, but it done
>> > > > > via DOS and doesn't do USB connections. :(
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Thank you in advance. :)
>>
>> > > > Check out seagate seatools online. See if that does what you want.
>>
>> > > It does not.
>>
>> > You don't even know what 'he wants'.

>> Read his OP, then you too may know what he wants...

> Yes, and obviously you didn't or you would have known that he
> doesn't want to do a SMART test. He wants to exercise the drive.
> A S.M.A.R.T test hardly exercises the drive.

>>
>> > > I checked recently
>>
>> > And how exactly did you check?

> Right, and now we know you didn't.

>>
>> > > because someone claimed these tools could do SMART over USB.
>>
>> > He doesn't want to.
>>
>> > > They can not.
>>
>> > That's what you say. Your word against theirs.

>> They don't claim it does SMART over USB.

> The "someone" did.

SEAGATE does not clkaim SMART capability for the USB-compatible
tests. They do know how this works and what they can and cannot
do.

>> I just verified that it indeed cannot.

> But you cannot and will not tell how.

Just so to not give anybody the wrong idea about this "budd"
fellow, one approach is as follows: Run tests with USB
and then check with (S)ATA if there are additional self-test
result in the disk's log. Easy, really.

Arno



From: Arno Wagner on 20 Dec 2006 21:05
Previously ANTant(a)zimage.com wrote:
[...]
> Sorry I meant custom enclosures that you buy for HDDs. At home, I have
> an external Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 (ST325082 3A; 250 GB HDD; 7200 RPM)
> in a Kingwin HDD Enclosure (MS-350U-S) via USB (connected when needed).
> I noticed this one has a few more vents more than Maxtor's enclosure.

Convection cooling is tricky. It usually does not work too well.

(Example for fluids: The technicians at Cernobyl wanted to find out
whether their reactor had adequate convewction cooling. The results
were a bit worse than expected...)

A fan, on the other hand, is a reliable way to get a defined
airflow. And airflow makes all the difference in cooling.

Arno
From: ANTant on 21 Dec 2006 01:16
> >> >> A third; only power the drive up when doing a backup ?
> >> >> It won't get very hot, or for lots of hours.

> >> > Backups involve having the drive very active for longish periods.
> >> > That's what makes drives get hot, from what I can tell. I have a 3.5"
> >> > 160gb Seagate 7200.x drive (not sure of exact model) in a generic usb2
> >> > enclosure with a tiny fan. It runs cool when idling or slightly
> >> > active even when I run it overnight. But doing a backup, it's quite
> >> > warm after 10 minutes or so, and the backup takes much longer than
> >> > that.

> >> For short backups, it should be ok. For any longer activity, only
> >> adequate cooling will work. Not that Seagates or Samsungs are quite
> >> as sensitive to heat, but hot HDD are never good.

> > Hmm, I guess I know why this HDD has problem. I *DID* use it as a
> > regular drive. I didn't care how slow USB2 was. It was basically for
> > playing back music, videos, copy VMware images, etc.

> > I did notice this Maxtor USB HDD has one vent on the back. The case did
> > get hot after a few hours.

> There is your problem...

Are there any external HDDs that don't get hot easily? Maybe I should
remove all my enclosures if I want to use them a lot, Heh.
--
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/\___/\
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\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
From: Rod Speed on 21 Dec 2006 13:21
ANTant(a)zimage.com wrote:
>>>>>> A third; only power the drive up when doing a backup ?
>>>>>> It won't get very hot, or for lots of hours.
>
>>>>> Backups involve having the drive very active for longish periods.
>>>>> That's what makes drives get hot, from what I can tell. I have a
>>>>> 3.5" 160gb Seagate 7200.x drive (not sure of exact model) in a
>>>>> generic usb2 enclosure with a tiny fan. It runs cool when idling
>>>>> or slightly active even when I run it overnight. But doing a
>>>>> backup, it's quite warm after 10 minutes or so, and the backup
>>>>> takes much longer than that.
>
>>>> For short backups, it should be ok. For any longer activity, only
>>>> adequate cooling will work. Not that Seagates or Samsungs are quite
>>>> as sensitive to heat, but hot HDD are never good.
>
>>> Hmm, I guess I know why this HDD has problem. I *DID* use it as a
>>> regular drive. I didn't care how slow USB2 was. It was basically for
>>> playing back music, videos, copy VMware images, etc.
>
>>> I did notice this Maxtor USB HDD has one vent on the back. The case
>>> did get hot after a few hours.
>
>> There is your problem...

> Are there any external HDDs that don't get hot easily?

Yes, there are a few.

> Maybe I should remove all my enclosures if I want to use them a lot, Heh.

Some drives get surprisingly hot when run loose on the desktop, essentially
because they are designed to get rid of a lot of the heat by conduction to
the metal drive bay stack and that isnt there in that situation.


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