Jihad needs scientists
in [Design]
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From: krw on 6 Jan 2007 15:45 In article <5a100$459fe8df$cdd0854f$21662(a)DIALUPUSA.NET>, unsettled(a)nonsense.com says... > T Wake wrote: > > > "Eeyore" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message > > news:459F9E54.540DD7DE(a)hotmail.com... > > >>>Maybe. Personally I think of McDonalds as a choice in the same manner as > >>>(for example) Sayers. > > >>I don't know Sayers ! > > > Bakers chain. Make lovely pasties. (Of Cornish fame). > > I live in a region with a strong mining history. Pasties > not only famous here but there are actually specialty > restaurants that have only pasties and something to drink > on the menu. Grab your drink out of a glass front fridge > next to the register. My mother made pasties (my father's family was from Cornwall). She handed the recipe down to my wife who also makes a good one, though not often. They're a lot of work. > Of course we have variations, including what is called > a Pizza Pasty, vegetarian pasties, and occasionally > some other variation plays in the region for a while. > > Pasty pockets are little 2 inch versions of their big > brothers. Handy to grab out of a bag to eat while driving. > They're sold in groups of 4 for $1.00. > > Great alternative to McDonald s, replacing lots of grease > with plenty of carbohydrates and not overwhelming the > individual with protein either. > And I get may daily dose of veggies too (ketchup ;-). > > > -- Keith
From: unsettled on 6 Jan 2007 18:34 T Wake wrote: > "unsettled" <unsettled(a)nonsense.com> wrote in message > news:5a100$459fe8df$cdd0854f$21662(a)DIALUPUSA.NET... > >>T Wake wrote: >> >> >>>"Eeyore" <rabbitsfriendsandrelations(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >>>news:459F9E54.540DD7DE(a)hotmail.com... >> >>>>>Maybe. Personally I think of McDonalds as a choice in the same manner as >>>>>(for example) Sayers. >> >>>>I don't know Sayers ! >> >>>Bakers chain. Make lovely pasties. (Of Cornish fame). >> >>I live in a region with a strong mining history. Pasties >>not only famous here but there are actually specialty >>restaurants that have only pasties and something to drink >>on the menu. Grab your drink out of a glass front fridge >>next to the register. >> >>Of course we have variations, including what is called >>a Pizza Pasty, vegetarian pasties, and occasionally >>some other variation plays in the region for a while. >> >>Pasty pockets are little 2 inch versions of their big >>brothers. Handy to grab out of a bag to eat while driving. >>They're sold in groups of 4 for $1.00. >> >>Great alternative to McDonald s, replacing lots of grease >>with plenty of carbohydrates and not overwhelming the >>individual with protein either. > > > In most circumstances the pasties are a "healthier" choice than a Big Mac, > but it remains a choice. I doubt anyone would suggest living on nothing but > Cornish pasties.... LOL. Fact is the miners used to have last night's leftovers wrapped up in a crust as their lunch. So it was their mainstay, at least here, after a fashion.
From: unsettled on 6 Jan 2007 18:55 T Wake wrote: > "unsettled" <unsettled(a)nonsense.com> wrote in message > news:33d58$459f02b2$cdd0852e$16293(a)DIALUPUSA.NET... >>>Personally, I feel that the *only* solution is to educate the electorate >>>(forcibly?). >>We're already paying for the electorate to be educated, but the >>results are awful. > When it comes to science, I wholeheartedly agree. Although I do think > children today are better educated in a variety of other topics then say 100 > years ago (or even 50 years ago). Find some turn of the 19th to 20th century school textbooks. I think you'll be astonished at what was taught to students back then compared to the last few decades. > The problem with education, is that it has > become "democratic" and everyone gets an equal shot. There is a method to the madness of the Montessori system. I didn't used to think much of the principles, but with age and looking at it over a longer period I can see why it is claimed to be such a success. The student pigeonholes himself much better than any test can. In such a setting the student becomes his best, and most effective, advocate. A really good teacher (how many of those can you remember?) then directs the student's interests in several directions at every juncture, making sure that the necessary to life essentials are covered and understood. Compare this to grad school. > Would an acceptable > option be returning to the schools of my youth when you sat > an exam at 11 to decide if the rest of your education was > going to be in a proper school or in a "technical school" > (where you learned things like woodwork and metal > work). The current alternative resembles Peter's Principle in education where the youngster rises rapidly to his level of incompetence and progresses no more. How's your dropout rate in the UK high schools?
From: unsettled on 6 Jan 2007 19:08 T Wake wrote: > "unsettled" <unsettled(a)nonsense.com> wrote in message > news:a054b$459fe661$cdd0854f$21620(a)DIALUPUSA.NET... > >>T Wake wrote: >>Lets put it this way. If the process for partial hydrogenation >>were up for US FDA approval today, would it be approved? Probably >>not. So we're playing catch up in a way, and I don't think that's >>necessarily a bad thing. > There are lots of things available today which would struggle to get > government approval if they were only just discovered / invented. > It is not necessarily a bad thing, but neither is it automatically a good > thing. > Should all products currently available be reviewed in light of their > ability to pass current health legislation and approval? Sounds like a good solution to me. >>The existence of artificial trans fats should be eliminated >>altogether IMO. I don't care that much about the actual inclusion >>so long as a skull and crossbones adorn the front of the label >>as they do for other toxic substances sold to the general public. > Toxicity is an interesting concept but this is the pedant in me coming to > the surface again. > Personally I would have no issues what so ever with a requirement for food > producers to mark their products witha skull and crossbones to inform > consumers as to the contents. > It would also have to apply to lots of other products which can be > determined "toxic" though. Now you're cooking! Start with tobacco. There are many others. >>>What do you mean by "totally natural product?" I can be pedantic [*] and >>>we could argue that eating supernatural food is an odd concept, but I >>>think I get your point here. >>I think you've flummoxed him. Good man! > That wasn't really my aim - unlike some people I have no "ill feelings" > towards Eeyore and don't think that because I disagree with him on one topic > it makes him intrinsically "wrong." There are topics I agree with him on. IMO he's "usually idiotic" though sometimes he gets things right. I have no patience left for his sort because I was in a position of having to deal for several years with an individual who came to very similar stupid questions. BAH seems to think him redeemable, I don't. > Oddly, there are even posts /BAH has made where I agree with her (not that > many, admittedly) and even more strangely I have found I agree with Joe Bloe > once in every thousand or so of his posts. I haven't run into anyone yet who is absolutely positively wrong 100% of the time. I suggest we all have some threshold for what we find unacceptable though. Eeyore was really quick across that line.
From: T Wake on 6 Jan 2007 19:56
"unsettled" <unsettled(a)nonsense.com> wrote in message news:d7738$45a036e8$cdd084a4$23461(a)DIALUPUSA.NET... >T Wake wrote: > >> "unsettled" <unsettled(a)nonsense.com> wrote in message >> news:33d58$459f02b2$cdd0852e$16293(a)DIALUPUSA.NET... > >>>>Personally, I feel that the *only* solution is to educate the electorate >>>>(forcibly?). > >>>We're already paying for the electorate to be educated, but the >>>results are awful. > >> When it comes to science, I wholeheartedly agree. Although I do think >> children today are better educated in a variety of other topics then say >> 100 years ago (or even 50 years ago). > > Find some turn of the 19th to 20th century school textbooks. > I think you'll be astonished at what was taught to students > back then compared to the last few decades. While I don't doubt that some parts of older education systems were taught in better detail than today, the point I was trying to make is that at the turn of the century there was a much smaller percentage of the population who underwent the full education system. In effect, the current situation means that many, many more people have access to things which were taught in tertiary education a hundred years ago. The fall out of this, given that the time a student is in an education system is finite, means that there is possibly less detail taught to the general students. I still think, clever students who have been educated well today are *better* educated than clever students who were educated well a hundred years ago. The problem with the comparison is that today the dross are also undergoing the school system instead of cleaning chimneys like they really should be doing. > > The problem with education, is that it has > > become "democratic" and everyone gets an equal shot. > > There is a method to the madness of the Montessori system. > I didn't used to think much of the principles, but with age > and looking at it over a longer period I can see why it is > claimed to be such a success. The student pigeonholes himself > much better than any test can. I dont know anything about the Montessori system so I cant really comment on this. I am not sure the student pidgeonholes himself very well as a child though. When I sat the 11 plus exam, I didnt see the point in "learning" things because at age 11, I just wanted to be a soldier and fight in wars. I quickly grew up a little and applied myself reasonable well in secondary school (however, no interest in 11 plus meant I was limited to what I could do) and I ended up joining the army anyway (no other options were available to me by the time I left school). Now I am older, I look back and wish I hadn't been able to influence my future to such a degree at such a young age. Fortunately the UK abolished the 11 plus and every one was given equal access to education. Unfortunately it seems to be back (under a slightly different guise). > In such a setting the student > becomes his best, and most effective, advocate. A really good > teacher (how many of those can you remember?) then directs the > student's interests in several directions at every juncture, > making sure that the necessary to life essentials are covered > and understood. > > Compare this to grad school. I am not sure what grad school is like for 18, 19 and 20 year olds. I was a mature student and for me at least, I found the lecturers and professors amazingly enthusiastic, encouraging and helpful. Doing a subject which didnt interest many people helped. If I had done drama or some such oversubscribed nonsense it may have been different. For me, there is a world of difference between learning as a "child" (say ages 11 - 16) and learning as an "adult" (18+) and they require radically different teaching styles. I personally think education is wasted on the young. > > Would an acceptable > > option be returning to the schools of my youth when you sat > > an exam at 11 to decide if the rest of your education was > > going to be in a proper school or in a "technical school" > > (where you learned things like woodwork and metal > > work). > > The current alternative resembles Peter's Principle in education > where the youngster rises rapidly to his level of incompetence > and progresses no more. > > How's your dropout rate in the UK high schools? I have no idea. Non existent when I went to school. School is compulsory from age 5 - 16, after that it is optional. Most people who stay on for A levels (16 - 18) finish. What grades they get is another matter (although this is going up each year to the point where the gutter tabloids can scream "farce"). University drop out rates (when I went) were about 20% in the first year, about 5% in the second and unheard of in the third year. No idea what it is like now. |