ls has stopped using the ISO date format
in [Debian]
|
Prev: Update GRUB to GRUB2 / Lenny to Squeeze
Next: Blockage on Internet maps - is a firewall intervening? Was: Re: PART DIAGNOSED: Re: Trying to install Google Earth on Lenny. How on earth??????
From: Andrei Popescu on 2 Jun 2010 02:50 On Ma, 01 iun 10, 15:44:49, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote: > > > Of course, SUS basically ignores any locale other than "POSIX" or "C", > > > but there is rarely a good reason to be different in other locales. > > > > One reason would be that '%b %e %Y' makes sense only to Americans >:-) > > In this specific case, I'd say that is a good reason to be different. I > wouldn't say ISO format is the correct way to be different -- probably > something that uses '%b', '%e', and '%Y' and has 3 spaces, but not is the same > order is appropriate. > > That's just my gut feeling though. It's a local(e) thing, so I can only > really speak for en_US(a)Arkansas. Unfortunately ls is going against the locale here: ,----[ /usr/share/i18n/ro_RO ] | LC_TIME ... | % Appropriate date and time representation (%c) ... | % "%a %d %b %Y %T %z" | d_t_fmt "<U0025><U0061><U0020><U0025><U0064><U0020><U0025><U0062><U0020>/ | <U0025><U0059><U0020><U0025><U0054><U0020><U0025><U007A>" | % | % Appropriate date representation (%x) | % "%d.%m.%Y" | d_fmt "<U0025><U0064><U002E><U0025><U006D><U002E><U0025><U0059>" ... | END LC_TIME `---- Regards, Andrei -- Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic
From: Daniel Barclay on 3 Jun 2010 11:40 Stephan Seitz wrote: > On Tue, Jun 01, 2010 at 10:58:09AM -0400, Daniel Barclay wrote: .... > >> That's why the ISO date formats are numeric: As long as one uses >> [whatever the right name for our Arabic-digit-based decimal system >> is], one can read the ISO date format. > > Only if you know, it is ISO date format. Using the name for the month > does not make things more complicated with the exception of parsing the > output with another program. Yes, it does make things more complicated: That other program has to have 12 month strings--and then one set of 12 for each language that might need to be recognized. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST(a)lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster(a)lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4C07CC47.3040008(a)fgm.com
From: Daniel Barclay on 3 Jun 2010 11:50 Ron Johnson wrote: > On 06/01/2010 10:06 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: >> Andrei Popescu wrote: >> ... >>> >>> You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date >>> format is used. Let me see... >>> >>> -rwx------ 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg >>> -rwx------ 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg >>> >>> Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How >>> (I'd really like to know)? >> >> The third of May, because it's recognizable as the ISO date/time >> format (because of the hyphens, and, in that case, because of the >> time format (no "am" or "pm") and position (after the date part)). >> >> Yes, that depends on there not being any similar format that uses >> hyphens but a different number order, but there isn't, is there? >> >> And even if one doesn't already know the ISO format, one could easily >> recognize from the year, hour, and minute that the components are >> in descending size order (year before month, month before day of >> month, etc.) >> > > 03-05-2010 > > There's no way on Earth to *know* whether this date is May 3rd or March > 5th. So? (What's your point? We were talking about the ISO date format, the ISO date format when time fields are present, and, earlier, common local data formats. Your example clearly isn't one of the first two. Are you claiming that some local data format uses that component order _and_ uses hyphens?) Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST(a)lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster(a)lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4C07CA2F.8010107(a)fgm.com
From: Ron Johnson on 3 Jun 2010 12:10 On 06/03/2010 10:28 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: > Ron Johnson wrote: >> On 06/01/2010 10:06 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: >>> Andrei Popescu wrote: >>> ... >>>> >>>> You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date >>>> format is used. Let me see... >>>> >>>> -rwx------ 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg >>>> -rwx------ 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg >>>> >>>> Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How >>>> (I'd really like to know)? >>> >>> The third of May, because it's recognizable as the ISO date/time >>> format (because of the hyphens, and, in that case, because of the >>> time format (no "am" or "pm") and position (after the date part)). >>> >>> Yes, that depends on there not being any similar format that uses >>> hyphens but a different number order, but there isn't, is there? >>> >>> And even if one doesn't already know the ISO format, one could easily >>> recognize from the year, hour, and minute that the components are >>> in descending size order (year before month, month before day of >>> month, etc.) >>> >> >> 03-05-2010 >> >> There's no way on Earth to *know* whether this date is May 3rd or >> March 5th. > > So? (What's your point? We were talking about the ISO date format, > the ISO date format when time fields are present, and, earlier, > common local data formats. Your example clearly isn't one of the > first two. Are you claiming that some local data format uses that > component order _and_ uses hyphens?) > I interpreted Andrei's email as referring to the ambiguities in the file *names* (like 03052010065.jpg), not the fs timestamps. -- Dissent is patriotic, remember? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST(a)lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster(a)lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4C07D1B3.6010001(a)cox.net
From: Daniel Barclay on 3 Jun 2010 12:10
Ron Johnson wrote: > On 06/03/2010 10:28 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: >> Ron Johnson wrote: >>> On 06/01/2010 10:06 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: >>>> Andrei Popescu wrote: >>>> ... >>>>> >>>>> You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date >>>>> format is used. Let me see... >>>>> >>>>> -rwx------ 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg >>>>> -rwx------ 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg >>>>> >>>>> Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How >>>>> (I'd really like to know)? >>>> >>>> The third of May, because it's recognizable as the ISO date/time >>>> format .... >>>> >>> >>> 03-05-2010 >>> >>> There's no way on Earth to *know* whether this date is May 3rd or >>> March 5th. >> >> So? (What's your point? We were talking about the ISO date format, >> the ISO date format when time fields are present, and, earlier, >> common local data formats. Your example clearly isn't one of the >> first two. Are you claiming that some local data format uses that >> component order _and_ uses hyphens?) >> > > I interpreted Andrei's email as referring to the ambiguities in the file > *names* (like 03052010065.jpg), not the fs timestamps. Okay, gotcha now. Yes, I was addressing the ls timestamp output. Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST(a)lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster(a)lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4C07D31D.9070104(a)fgm.com |