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From: Nick Naym on 29 Dec 2009 17:40 In article 291220090133084132%aeiou(a)mostly.invalid, Mark Conrad at aeiou(a)mostly.invalid wrote on 12/29/09 4:33 AM: > In article <see.signature-F2A243.23254828122009(a)news.qwest.net>, > somnambulist <see.signature(a)uswest.net> wrote: > >>> What is your suggestion for that gnarly problem? >> >> I've been following this thread and will briefly delurk to provide >> another perspective. >> >> I've been practicing neurosurgery for 30 years, and every male member >> of my family has been a doctor since the 1860s, so I have some >> historical perspective. >> >> There is no simple solution, private or public sector, to providing >> healthcare, let alone healthcare to all. >> >> So here's the perspective of one practicing doctor: > > <snipped very interesting perspective> > > Thank you very much for your post. > > Parts of your post are very depressing to me, the part > where you post that medicine is no longer a profession, > but is now an industry. I find that very sad, trying to > use a doctor as a mere hired hand to follow orders, > rather than a respected professional. > > Isn't that what communism is all about? Yeah, Mark...that's what communism is all about. <sheesh> > "each person works and is paid by their abilities > and needs, as determined by czar Obama" "Obamacare" and "czar Obama?" Didn't Rush, et. al. come up with those derogatory terms? Name calling and rumor-mongering -- Obama is a terrorist-Muslim sympathizer, who isn't even an American citizen! -- is a favorite technique that the right-wing wingnits love to use to paint people into right-wing defined stereotypes, to incite and manipulate all of their mindless followers and supporters. > "My name is Obama, you _will_ bore open this man's > skull with my politically-approved low cost portable > drill from WalMart, repair his aneurysm, and oh yes, > sweep the floor of the stockroom afterwards". Writing a book called "The World According to Mark?" > From the little I read, the new health bill is attempting You've read very little, and understand even less. > to herd all the doctors together into one large cattle call, > uprooting them from their private professional practices > with a combination of penalties and encentives, > because that makes it a lot easier for the CC > (Congress Critters) to control them as hired hands > when the doctors are in one large standardized group > like the Kaiser-Permanente group. Yeah...that group is suspected of planning to undermine Democracy too. After all, it has the very undemocratic, foreign monarch name "Kaiser" in it. (Hmmm...I bet those Kaisers were all closet Nazis, too.) > I actually wonder why anyone would choose to pursue > a medical career these days, there is little incentive. > > Mark- Medical professionals began to lose their independence as private practitioners years ago when HMOs began to proliferate. (Are the unregulated HMOs part of the Communist Conspiracy? I thought they were part of the Corporate Dictum.) -- iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) � OS X (10.5.8)
From: Nick Naym on 29 Dec 2009 17:41 In article hhd7jm$lbm$1(a)news.albasani.net, AV3 at arvimide(a)earthlink.net wrote on 12/29/09 10:35 AM: > On Dec/28/2009 8:0342 PM, Wes Groleau wrote: >> AV3 wrote: >>> On Dec/27/2009 11:4206 PM, Wes Groleau wrote: >>>> He also promised to do something about "ear-marks" which make up >>>> a large percentage of what the House and Senate have passed. >>> >>> This is not relevant to the merits or demerits of the health care bill. >> >> It most certainly is relevant. We could have had a hundred page >> reform bill passed nearly unanimously months ago, if those claiming >> to represent us had agreed to table any point on which consensus >> couldn't be reached quickly. Instead, we have thousands of pages >> which almost half of both Congress and the country is fighting bitterly. >> >> In other words, we could have, months ago, had _some_ reform. >> Everyone would still say it's inadequate, but everyone (almost) >> would agree it's a start, and everyone (almost) would like it. >> >> And THEN we could argue about the hard parts. >> > > > Obama didn't run on offering the lowest common denominator of a health > policy, he promised to reverse the increasing deprivation of coverage > and to extend coverage as widely as possible. He has the majority for > himself and his party in Congress to do it, and they are doing it. If > what they do is unsatisfactory to the public, the next elections should > tell us about it. A piecemeal, consensus process would change nothing > and satisfy only those who want no effective change. > You just don't understand: Providing affordable health care to every citizen as a fundamental right is a Muslim/Communist plot to undermine our Capitalist Democracy. -- iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) � OS X (10.5.8)
From: Su-Z-Q on 30 Dec 2009 06:21 In article <hhd7jm$lbm$1(a)news.albasani.net>, AV3 <arvimide(a)earthlink.net> wrote: > Obama didn't run on offering the lowest common denominator of a health > policy, he promised to reverse the increasing deprivation of coverage > and to extend coverage as widely as possible. He has the majority for > himself and his party in Congress to do it, and they are doing it. If > what they do is unsatisfactory to the public, the next elections should > tell us about it. A piecemeal, consensus process would change nothing > and satisfy only those who want no effective change. Well, we hear a lot of grousing but it seems all of it is coming from the people who already HAVE health insurance. I'd like to hear some of the folks who've been surviving WITHOUT insurance comment on the planned changes. -- Facts are stubborn, but statistics are more pliable. Mark Twain
From: Kurt Ullman on 30 Dec 2009 07:14 In article <hhfd3j$5u7$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, Su-Z-Q <reply(a)this.group> wrote: > In article <hhd7jm$lbm$1(a)news.albasani.net>, AV3 <arvimide(a)earthlink.net> > wrote: > > > Obama didn't run on offering the lowest common denominator of a health > > policy, he promised to reverse the increasing deprivation of coverage > > and to extend coverage as widely as possible. He has the majority for > > himself and his party in Congress to do it, and they are doing it. If > > what they do is unsatisfactory to the public, the next elections should > > tell us about it. A piecemeal, consensus process would change nothing > > and satisfy only those who want no effective change. > > Well, we hear a lot of grousing but it seems all of it is coming from the > people > who already HAVE health insurance. I'd like to hear some of the folks who've > been surviving WITHOUT insurance comment on the planned changes. I'd like someone who has survived MedicAid also comment. We already know that the premier Federal program (MCare) is going bankrupt, has so many holes that people are almost required to buy gap insurance, and pays providers so little that patients are having problems finding docs who will take on new Mcare patients. -- To find that place where the rats don't race and the phones don't ring at all. If once, you've slept on an island. Scott Kirby "If once you've slept on an island"
From: Mark Conrad on 30 Dec 2009 07:53
In article <00abc155$0$8187$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com>, Warren Oates <warren.oates(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Yeah, my secondary insurance company (whoops, I said > > those nasty words "insurance company") - - - provides a > > free 24hr/365day nurse help line for me to use, those > > gals know their business > > Well, okay. Our communist Ontario health service provides > exactly the same thing, with an 800 number. Now now, you Canadians are not true communists yet, not until you have a czar to oversee your Ontario health service. We have a czar-in-waiting here in the US, so we are closer to being commies than you are. Actually, we are probably more "socialized" than you are, we just hate to admit it. We like to think that individual citizens are running the USA, but real power seems to be slipping away from citizens, government gangs seem to control everything lately, they call themselves "committees". Mark- |