Is the Unix shell possible under iPhoneOS?
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From: David Empson on 9 Mar 2010 04:14 Lewis <g.kreme(a)gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > In message <090320100107485894%nospam(a)nospam.invalid> > nospam <nospam(a)nospam.invalid> wrote: > > In article <slrnhpc330.1j9t.g.kreme(a)cerebus.local>, Lewis > > <g.kreme(a)gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > > >> >> Because it's all OS X underneath and Apple decided to allow the iphone > >> >> apps to run on the iPad. Apple *could* decide to allow iphone apps to > >> >> run on the iMac too, and they would. > >> > >> > they could, but it would be a shitload of effort and there's very > >> > little point in doing so. > >> > >> It would be practically no effort whatsoever. It's OS X all the way > >> down. > > > and an entirely different cpu. > > and your point is? You are aware that the Mac cna ALREADY run any iphone > app, right? Just not for the general public. No it can't. If you are thinking of the iPhone Simulator that comes with the iPhone SDK, that works by compiling your own iPhone application specifically to run on the simulator, using x86 instead of ARM executable code. You can't use it to run an arbitrary iPhone application for which you don't have the source code. -- David Empson dempson(a)actrix.gen.nz
From: nospam on 9 Mar 2010 04:52 In article <slrnhpc42b.2335.g.kreme(a)cerebus.local>, Lewis <g.kreme(a)gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > >> It would be practically no effort whatsoever. It's OS X all the way > >> down. > > > and an entirely different cpu. > > and your point is? You are aware that the Mac cna ALREADY run any iphone > app, right? Just not for the general public. no it can't.
From: nospam on 9 Mar 2010 04:52 In article <slrnhpc4od.2335.g.kreme(a)cerebus.local>, Lewis <g.kreme(a)gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > >> and your point is? You are aware that the Mac cna ALREADY run any iphone > >> app, right? Just not for the general public. > > > No it can't. > > > If you are thinking of the iPhone Simulator that comes with the iPhone > > SDK, that works by compiling your own iPhone application specifically to > > run on the simulator, using x86 instead of ARM executable code. > > Wait, so you're saying that the simulator can run an iphone app? hey, > that's exactly what I said. This is why it would be practically no > effort whatsoever. no it isn't what you said at all. the simulator runs iphone apps that are specifically compiled for x86, not the arm chip. the iphone runs apps that are compiled for arm. an app you buy on the apps store *will not work* in the simulator. period. in order for an off the shelf iphone app to run, apple would need to update rosetta to emulate the arm chip. they'd also need to update the simulator since it doesn't simulate everything, including the phone, camera, gps, compass and accelerometer. it's a rather huge undertaking, and not really worth the effort. > > You > > can't use it to run an arbitrary iPhone application for which you don't > > have the source code. > > Which is why I said it wasn't for the general public. But the fact is, > the same app runs on both an iphone and on a Mac. There's no porting, > reqriting, patching, editing, whatever. it just needs to be recompiled, and sometimes there are issues between the two cpus.
From: David Empson on 9 Mar 2010 05:23 nospam <nospam(a)nospam.invalid> wrote: > In article <slrnhpc4od.2335.g.kreme(a)cerebus.local>, Lewis > <g.kreme(a)gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > > > >> and your point is? You are aware that the Mac cna ALREADY run any iphone > > >> app, right? Just not for the general public. > > > > > No it can't. > > > > > If you are thinking of the iPhone Simulator that comes with the iPhone > > > SDK, that works by compiling your own iPhone application specifically to > > > run on the simulator, using x86 instead of ARM executable code. > > > > Wait, so you're saying that the simulator can run an iphone app? hey, > > that's exactly what I said. This is why it would be practically no > > effort whatsoever. > > no it isn't what you said at all. > > the simulator runs iphone apps that are specifically compiled for x86, > not the arm chip. the iphone runs apps that are compiled for arm. > > an app you buy on the apps store *will not work* in the simulator. > period. > > in order for an off the shelf iphone app to run, apple would need to > update rosetta to emulate the arm chip. Playing devil's advocate for a moment: Apple could support the development of a universal iPhone app which contains both ARM and x86 code. Such an application could run on both a real device and on the simulator on a Mac. I can't see any practical reason that they would want to do this because... > they'd also need to update the simulator since it doesn't simulate > everything, including the phone, camera, gps, compass and accelerometer. > it's a rather huge undertaking, and not really worth the effort. Plus the lack of multi-touch on the Mac. The majority of iPhone applications would be unusable by the average person if they were run inside the simulator. It is able to mimic multi-touch operations via a complex mechanism that a developer can use to do basic testing, but something which needs to react to real time multi-touch gestures can only be properly tested on a real device. Now, on a future Mac with a multi-touch trackpad that has a screen behind it (as some rumours were suggesting a while ago), we might be talking about something practical. I still don't think Apple would bother. It would be a huge amount of development effort, which isn't likely to encourage further hardware sales. Apple would rather sell the Mac users another device than give them a way of running iPhone applications on a Mac. -- David Empson dempson(a)actrix.gen.nz
From: nospam on 9 Mar 2010 05:44
In article <1jf4067.662udf1n7p1k5N%dempson(a)actrix.gen.nz>, David Empson <dempson(a)actrix.gen.nz> wrote: > Playing devil's advocate for a moment: Apple could support the > development of a universal iPhone app which contains both ARM and x86 > code. Such an application could run on both a real device and on the > simulator on a Mac. that would help, but it would make the apps larger, something that's not desirable for those who buy apps on an iphone over the cell network. > I can't see any practical reason that they would want to do this > because... > > > they'd also need to update the simulator since it doesn't simulate > > everything, including the phone, camera, gps, compass and accelerometer. > > it's a rather huge undertaking, and not really worth the effort. > > Plus the lack of multi-touch on the Mac. the trackpads are multitouch so it theoretically could work right now if the simulator was updated to support it. imac, mac pro and mac mini users need not apply. > The majority of iPhone applications would be unusable by the average > person if they were run inside the simulator. It is able to mimic > multi-touch operations via a complex mechanism that a developer can use > to do basic testing, but something which needs to react to real time > multi-touch gestures can only be properly tested on a real device. a lot of the apps don't make any sense to run on a mac. are people going to grab their laptop (or better yet, a 27" imac) to tilt and shake it for games? and since a lot of the apps are mini versions of desktop apps, why not just use the actual desktop version? on the other hand, the flashlight apps will be much more effective with a laptop screen. :) > I still don't think Apple would bother. It would be a huge amount of > development effort, which isn't likely to encourage further hardware > sales. exactly. what's the point? > Apple would rather sell the Mac users another device than give them a > way of running iPhone applications on a Mac. and such a device is under $200. |