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From: Kerry Brown on 15 May 2010 10:28 "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message news:u93fU#78KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. > > and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people > moving > and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. > And there is a lot of kick from IT > But Money talks > Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( > I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... > Russ I keep seeing this argument. Have you actually worked the numbers? It's almost impossible to get a price quote from the BPOS site but in one place they mention $10.00 per month. I have also heard $5.00 per month. Let's look at a site with 30 users. At $10.00 per month that is $3,600.00 per year. At $5.00 it's $1,800.00 per year. Most sites with 30 users will still need a server on site. They will need a DC and probably a file server, print server, and WSUS. For sure they will have a LOB app that needs a server. Given they already have at least one server and the associated costs of maintaining the hardware are you saying the actual maintenance of Exchange for 30 users is more than somewhere between $1,800 and $3,600 per year? Even if you add SharePoint in to the equation none of my clients spend anywhere near that on Exchange/SharePoint maintenance. Once Exchange and SharePoint are up and running it doesn't take a lot of time to maintain them for 30 users. For most of my clients I doubt I spend two hours a month on Exchange/SharePoint. Most of their costs are server/workstation depreciation, LOB app maintenance, networking hardware, and workstation maintenance. None of that goes away with BPOS. I can think of several reasons for using BPOS. Lower costs is not one of them. -- Kerry Brown MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/
From: Leythos on 15 May 2010 10:47 In article <Oe0xyrD9KHA.5476(a)TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl>, kerry(a)kdbNOSPAMsys- tems.c*a*m says... > > "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message > news:u93fU#78KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > > BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. > > > > and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people > > moving > > and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. > > And there is a lot of kick from IT > > But Money talks > > Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( > > I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... > > Russ > > I keep seeing this argument. Have you actually worked the numbers? It's > almost impossible to get a price quote from the BPOS site but in one place > they mention $10.00 per month. I have also heard $5.00 per month. Let's look > at a site with 30 users. At $10.00 per month that is $3,600.00 per year. At > $5.00 it's $1,800.00 per year. Most sites with 30 users will still need a > server on site. They will need a DC and probably a file server, print > server, and WSUS. For sure they will have a LOB app that needs a server. > Given they already have at least one server and the associated costs of > maintaining the hardware are you saying the actual maintenance of Exchange > for 30 users is more than somewhere between $1,800 and $3,600 per year? Even > if you add SharePoint in to the equation none of my clients spend anywhere > near that on Exchange/SharePoint maintenance. Once Exchange and SharePoint > are up and running it doesn't take a lot of time to maintain them for 30 > users. For most of my clients I doubt I spend two hours a month on > Exchange/SharePoint. Most of their costs are server/workstation > depreciation, LOB app maintenance, networking hardware, and workstation > maintenance. None of that goes away with BPOS. I can think of several > reasons for using BPOS. Lower costs is not one of them. I find that maintenance of Exchange, that being what is done AFTER the install, amounts to about a few hours per year. Once it's setup properly, considering you already have to do automatic updates, considering your firewall already updates your anti-spam, you really don't have any maintenance. As a matter of fact, Exchange is the lest maintenance of any of the server functions of anything we deal with. -- You can't trust your best friends, your five senses, only the little voice inside you that most civilians don't even hear -- Listen to that. Trust yourself. spam999free(a)rrohio.com (remove 999 for proper email address)
From: Charlie Russel - MVP on 15 May 2010 10:47 Horsepucky. I buy (and configure) a server once. It's a capital expense. My ongoing incremental cost is nil. If I'm having a bad couple of months in the business (or a bad YEAR like a lot of companies have had), I can still do business without worrying about MS (or your favourite cloud service) cutting me off cause I can't pay. Sorry, I think you're way, way off base. Yes, there is a place for the cloud, but I don't see it as the cure all that you appear to. -- Charlie. http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message news:u93fU%2378KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. > > and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people > moving > and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. > And there is a lot of kick from IT > But Money talks > Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( > I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... > Russ > > -- > Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] > MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC > Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz > BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com > > > "Charlie Russel - MVP" <Charlie(a)mvKILLALLSPAMMERSps.org> wrote in message > news:OdOVq678KHA.4600(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >> Sorry, BPOS will never be my first choice. Frankly, I don't want anyone >> else with their hands in my pocket every single month or my business is >> dead. My monthly nut is quite large enough, without adding to it. >> >> -- >> Charlie. >> http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel >> >> >> >> >> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message >> news:FF17FB09-16D8-4DC1-AE0C-EA10F3662BFE(a)microsoft.com... >>>I know this is a Sales Pitch >>> >>> but this would be a great time to move to BPOS >>> You'd just need 1 Server for Files >>> and one for any LOB >>> >>> SharePoint and Exchange would be in the cloud >>> visit www.BPOSMadeEasy.com >>> or a search for bpos on the web >>> >>> Or contact me offline russgrover @ kaitka.com >>> >>> It's cheaper to have exchange in the cloud than on premises now days :( >>> Russ >>> >>> -- >>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>> >>> >>> "Charlie Russel - MVP" <Charlie(a)mvKILLALLSPAMMERSps.org> wrote in >>> message news:OBQFtv28KHA.2248(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>> Plus I'm not at all sure I'd choose to move to EBS at this point, given >>>> that the product has been discontinued. A simple move off of SBS to >>>> "normal" Windows Server + Exchange could be done on fewer servers and >>>> with less pain, and would not have one looking at a potential second >>>> migration later. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Charlie. >>>> http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>>> news:e8s4Qu18KHA.2248(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>> You are correct. The three servers are installed individually, not >>>>> simultaneously. The third server to be installed is the messaging >>>>> server, so to migrate exchange, SBS must still be available *after* >>>>> the installation of the third server completes. Virtualizing can, of >>>>> course, keep the physical hardware count down, but careful >>>>> considerations must be made when deciding to virtualize. There are >>>>> trade-offs. >>>>> >>>>> -Cliff >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Jim Behning SBS MVP" <jimbehning(a)doesthisblockpork.mindspring.com> >>>>> wrote in message news:8ucqu55l5m4n1a10quo16vg5gl2jh47jdv(a)4ax.com... >>>>>> EBS is a three server solution. I have not installed one but I >>>>>> understand that part of the setup is seeing all three servers at the >>>>>> same time, but I could be wrong. I do not believe you can avoid three >>>>>> new servers. I believe part of the process is the new EBS pulls AD >>>>>> stuff over and Exchange stuff. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you export all of your email, do not care about AD and workstation >>>>>> profiles, and are not using Sharepoint then you could backup your old >>>>>> SBS, scrap the SBS 2008 and use the old SBS as one of your 3 new >>>>>> servers. >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloadS/details.aspx?familyid=191B141E-3A1F-4C1B-BD2D-15623751E518&displaylang=en >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, 14 May 2010 11:44:20 +0100, "John" >>>>>> <info(a)nospam.infovis.co.uk> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>Hi >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Once we run out of 75 license limit of sbs 2008 premium is the >>>>>>>migration to >>>>>>>sbs 2008 essential an upgrade or a reinstall of the server is >>>>>>>required? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Many Thanks >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Regards >>>>>>> >>>>>> See what SBS support is working on >>>>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/default.aspx >>>>>> Check your SBS with the SBS Best Practices Analyzer >>>>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/tags/BPA/default.aspx >>>>> >>>> >>
From: Charlie Russel - MVP on 15 May 2010 10:48 Amen. -- Charlie. http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel "Kerry Brown" <kerry(a)kdbNOSPAMsys-tems.c*a*m> wrote in message news:Oe0xyrD9KHA.5476(a)TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... > > "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message > news:u93fU#78KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >> BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. >> >> and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people >> moving >> and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. >> And there is a lot of kick from IT >> But Money talks >> Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( >> I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... >> Russ > > I keep seeing this argument. Have you actually worked the numbers? It's > almost impossible to get a price quote from the BPOS site but in one place > they mention $10.00 per month. I have also heard $5.00 per month. Let's > look at a site with 30 users. At $10.00 per month that is $3,600.00 per > year. At $5.00 it's $1,800.00 per year. Most sites with 30 users will > still need a server on site. They will need a DC and probably a file > server, print server, and WSUS. For sure they will have a LOB app that > needs a server. Given they already have at least one server and the > associated costs of maintaining the hardware are you saying the actual > maintenance of Exchange for 30 users is more than somewhere between $1,800 > and $3,600 per year? Even if you add SharePoint in to the equation none of > my clients spend anywhere near that on Exchange/SharePoint maintenance. > Once Exchange and SharePoint are up and running it doesn't take a lot of > time to maintain them for 30 users. For most of my clients I doubt I spend > two hours a month on Exchange/SharePoint. Most of their costs are > server/workstation depreciation, LOB app maintenance, networking hardware, > and workstation maintenance. None of that goes away with BPOS. I can think > of several reasons for using BPOS. Lower costs is not one of them. > > -- > Kerry Brown > MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration > http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/ > > > >
From: Larry Struckmeyer[SBS-MVP] on 15 May 2010 11:14
Amen to the Amen. For one or two users hosted exchange is a deal. For 10+ is seems to be a monthly charge that, projected over the life of the system exceeds the incremental cost of adding exchange (or some mail server) to a network. This is more than a math question, however, factor in "owning' your own data, ability to use said data when the internet is off line, and subtract the agro of maintaining your own mail server of whatever ilk, and imo, for an orginization of more than just a few users local mail wins over hosted mail. - Larry Please post the resolution to your issue so others may benefit - Get Your SBS Health Check at www.sbsbpa.com > Amen. > > "Kerry Brown" <kerry(a)kdbNOSPAMsys-tems.c*a*m> wrote in message > news:Oe0xyrD9KHA.5476(a)TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl... > >> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in >> message news:u93fU#78KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >> >>> BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. >>> >>> and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people >>> moving >>> and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. >>> And there is a lot of kick from IT >>> But Money talks >>> Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( >>> I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... >>> Russ >> I keep seeing this argument. Have you actually worked the numbers? >> It's almost impossible to get a price quote from the BPOS site but in >> one place they mention $10.00 per month. I have also heard $5.00 per >> month. Let's look at a site with 30 users. At $10.00 per month that >> is $3,600.00 per year. At $5.00 it's $1,800.00 per year. Most sites >> with 30 users will still need a server on site. They will need a DC >> and probably a file server, print server, and WSUS. For sure they >> will have a LOB app that needs a server. Given they already have at >> least one server and the associated costs of maintaining the hardware >> are you saying the actual maintenance of Exchange for 30 users is >> more than somewhere between $1,800 and $3,600 per year? Even if you >> add SharePoint in to the equation none of my clients spend anywhere >> near that on Exchange/SharePoint maintenance. Once Exchange and >> SharePoint are up and running it doesn't take a lot of time to >> maintain them for 30 users. For most of my clients I doubt I spend >> two hours a month on Exchange/SharePoint. Most of their costs are >> server/workstation depreciation, LOB app maintenance, networking >> hardware, and workstation maintenance. None of that goes away with >> BPOS. I can think of several reasons for using BPOS. Lower costs is >> not one of them. >> >> -- >> Kerry Brown >> MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration >> http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/ |