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From: Kerry Brown on 16 May 2010 19:22 > My clients that are on SBS right now, and are getting to end of life on > hardware. > I'm moving them to BPOS, because I can't rightfully justify an onsite > exchange server. > The value added from on site, and the cost just doesn't pan out.... > > Clients want Constant reoccurring costs that don't vary from year to year. > > Yes I will make more money if I push a Exchange server on them. > But I can't honestly tell them this, > when there is a cheaper more reliable solution... BPOS > > I urge you with doubts, to actually check out BPOS you can get a free > account at > www.BPOSMadeEasy.com > > Once you hook it up, I highly doubt if you can tell the difference between > local exchange and remote? > (Because it's RPC over HTTPS) > Some clients want constant reoccurring costs, some don't. If you think the costs won't vary from year to year then I'd urge you to look at the mobile phone or cable TV industries. You (and others) keep saying the cloud will save a small business money but you don't provide figures. When I work the numbers, which I already posted, it doesn't work out that way. Can you point me to a study or provide some numbers to prove show how a small business with fifteen users and two LOB apps will save money by switching to BPOS or any other cloud solution? I have checked out BPOS. It works great. It is almost exactly the same experience as an on site Exchange server. The user experience I have no problem with. For me it all comes down to numbers and I haven't seen numbers that work for small business. You seem to think I'm resistant to or against the cloud. I'm not. I see a huge future for the cloud, especially for LOB apps. I am resistant to moving my clients to something that I think will cost them more money for the same experience they have now. If that changes or someone shows me my figures are wrong I would recommend they switch immediately. As it is now the cloud is immature and expensive. When it's mature and inexpensive I fully expect to be recommending it. -- Kerry Brown MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/
From: Cliff Galiher - MVP on 16 May 2010 19:25 Unfortunately you are missing my point. That 1.5 billion is not an accurate comparison on what MS is betting on *for* the cloud. A few examples of what gets counted in that 1.5 Billion: XBox Live. This is a HUGE service with millions of daily users. That is a lot of servers, a lot of salaries, and a lot of regular upgrades. That costs money. It is a cloud service. But it is COMPLEMENTARY to the XBox devices and does not compete with them. It drives sales of the hardware, games, and licensing fees MS charges developers. But when counting money spent on the cloud, everything spent on XBox Live counts. Zune Marketplace. Now, maybe the Zune standalone player will not survive the MS cutbacks. Maybe it will. Who knows. But as of right now, portable music still needs some sort of device. Whether it is a zune player, a phone-like device (I'm thinking of the recently released Kin devices) or Windows Phone 7, the Zune brand would not do well solely in the cloud. It's major selling point is that it complements portable music, just like iTunes complements iPods. Yet, the Zune service is "in the cloud" and thus every penny spent on it counts. Hotmail. Yes, because we are an SBS newsgroup, we discuss Exchange and, by proxy, hosted Exchange services are bound to get discussed...including Exchange Defender and BPOS. But if hosted Exchange is counted as "cloud" spending, then certainly hotmail is as well. But MS has had Hotmail for *YEARS* and it has not threatened their desktop email client (Outlook Express turned Windows Mail in Vista turned Windows Live Mail). The two complement each other. Sometimes people just want to be able to archive and read mail offline. So, to recap, yes the cloud is a "direction" and not a side-road. But it is not the ONLY direction. MS is big enough to bet on multiple technologies, integrate them where it makes sense, and discard them where they don't fit or fail to meet expectations or demand...think of the hosted Silverlight platform that MS offered free space on for awhile. MS had no problems canning *that* and if they were really thinking "cloud no matter what" then that service would have continued despite its shortcomings. One final note: As far as the "we all lose," I couldn't disagree more. When MS diversifies, whether you are an MS partner or an MS end-user, it gives you a chance to use their new products and/or services where it makes sense. If you are a partner, you now have new things to sell. If you put all your eggs in one basket and they pull the plug, yes you will lose. But that is like betting on one number in roulette (I wanted to get back to that analogy.) However most consultants and value-added companyes (resellers, consultants, service providers, etc) sell not just MS, but Cisco, Calyptix, 3CX, and other products and services to allow themselves in maneuverability in offering the best solution for their customers. If MS gets into a new market and can offer a compelling solution by betting on a new market segment, WE also win if it succeeds because we can now offer our services in that market (if your business plan executes it properly. Similarly, if you are an end-user of MS products, presumably the reason you'd switch to a new technology is because it offers more value for your dollar. That I also a win for the consumer as they get a better solution than they had before. Now, to stick with that analogy to the very end, yes...it is still a bet and one can still lose. I'm sure there are companies that bought into EBS that are now looking at spending more money on labor for migrations off of EBS than they originally planned. So, I'm not saying that betting with MS is always a way to win. What I am saying is that you don't have to view MS's desire to spend money on the cloud as adversarial. You can make the most of the situation, align yourself with their products and services where it complements your own business, and where it doesn't...look at competitors. And, to bring it full circlue, you don't have to assume that because MS is playing in a new market (the cloud) that they are going to abandon their steadfast money-making markets. They *can* (and in most cases WILL) co-exist, fulfilling different needs for different types of customers. The best consultants will know when to leverage each, and I think MS knows this and will keep their products on-site where it makes sense (in other words, Exchange ain't goin nowhere soon. It CERTAINLY has a place in the enterprise for a LOOOOONNNNNNGGGGGG time to come. By proxy, SBS is built from the variosu enterprise components, so integrating new versions is not *that* much of a financial dis-incentive for MS. As long as SBS keeps selling more than it costs to develop, I'd expect MS to keep developing new versions. -Cliff "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message news:urC#R0T9KHA.4768(a)TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > Well with 1.5Billion going to be invested by Microsoft > and Billions from others in the same game... > > If it is a roulette table, we will all lose.... > > Just look at where Microsoft Server technology is going? > Software Technology? All pointing to the cloud.... > > It's a Direction, not a side road..... > > Software will be 'on-demand' > Servers will be cloud, with pay for what you need... > > Microsoft will be a utility company.... just like your TV phone and > internet. > (Just my opinion.) > > Russ > > -- > Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] > MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC > Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz > BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com > > > "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message > news:95E7DEBF-17E2-4BE7-A0C9-1B24CC4BC793(a)microsoft.com... >> True, but MS doesn't play "war" (top card wins.) They play roulette and >> spread their bets. Good examples: >> >> XBox. They bet on HD-DVD over blu-ray (and lost) but also bet on >> streaming video with their own marketplace (successful) and the first >> (and still the only disc-less as far as I know) streaming netflix >> console. >> >> Office 2010: Online *and* client-based. >> >> VoIP: ResponsePoint *and* Office Communications Server. Not related >> technologies. >> >> Cloud storage: Skydrive *and* Mesh. So far, still two separate >> entities. >> >> Email: BPOS *and* Exchange (they did ship 2010, and didn't go strictly >> cloud.) >> >> ================ >> >> So by my observations, yes MS is betting heavily on the cloud. BUT >> pundits are adding an inaccurate and unspoken "only" in that sentence. >> They are implying that "MS is betting on *only* the cloud" and that there >> is some future where stand-alone boxes (whether it be PC, a dedicated >> video or gaming device, or mobile device) ceases to matter. And I argue >> exactly the opposite. The cloud is complementary to stand-alone devices. >> I think Exchange has a long future ahead yet. >> >> -Cliff >> >> >> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message >> news:41B9A93F-5CFC-4489-805D-1356EF3148BA(a)microsoft.com... >>> Well Microsoft is betting 1.5Billion on it... :) >>> >>> -- >>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>> >>> >>> "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>> news:093CAB9B-407E-4D45-A515-F3D068826A0C(a)microsoft.com... >>>> I'll take that bet. I think there is a looming backlash against "the >>>> cloud" because of reliability and privacy concerns. >>>> >>>> -Cliff >>>> >>>> >>>> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message >>>> news:u93fU#78KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>> BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. >>>>> >>>>> and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people >>>>> moving >>>>> and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. >>>>> And there is a lot of kick from IT >>>>> But Money talks >>>>> Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( >>>>> I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... >>>>> Russ >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>>>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>>>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>>>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Charlie Russel - MVP" <Charlie(a)mvKILLALLSPAMMERSps.org> wrote in >>>>> message news:OdOVq678KHA.4600(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >>>>>> Sorry, BPOS will never be my first choice. Frankly, I don't want >>>>>> anyone else with their hands in my pocket every single month or my >>>>>> business is dead. My monthly nut is quite large enough, without >>>>>> adding to it. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Charlie. >>>>>> http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in >>>>>> message news:FF17FB09-16D8-4DC1-AE0C-EA10F3662BFE(a)microsoft.com... >>>>>>>I know this is a Sales Pitch >>>>>>> >>>>>>> but this would be a great time to move to BPOS >>>>>>> You'd just need 1 Server for Files >>>>>>> and one for any LOB >>>>>>> >>>>>>> SharePoint and Exchange would be in the cloud >>>>>>> visit www.BPOSMadeEasy.com >>>>>>> or a search for bpos on the web >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Or contact me offline russgrover @ kaitka.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It's cheaper to have exchange in the cloud than on premises now days >>>>>>> :( >>>>>>> Russ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>>>>>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>>>>>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>>>>>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Charlie Russel - MVP" <Charlie(a)mvKILLALLSPAMMERSps.org> wrote in >>>>>>> message news:OBQFtv28KHA.2248(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>>>>> Plus I'm not at all sure I'd choose to move to EBS at this point, >>>>>>>> given that the product has been discontinued. A simple move off of >>>>>>>> SBS to "normal" Windows Server + Exchange could be done on fewer >>>>>>>> servers and with less pain, and would not have one looking at a >>>>>>>> potential second migration later. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Charlie. >>>>>>>> http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>>>>>>> news:e8s4Qu18KHA.2248(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>>>>>> You are correct. The three servers are installed individually, >>>>>>>>> not simultaneously. The third server to be installed is the >>>>>>>>> messaging server, so to migrate exchange, SBS must still be >>>>>>>>> available *after* the installation of the third server completes. >>>>>>>>> Virtualizing can, of course, keep the physical hardware count >>>>>>>>> down, but careful considerations must be made when deciding to >>>>>>>>> virtualize. There are trade-offs. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -Cliff >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> "Jim Behning SBS MVP" >>>>>>>>> <jimbehning(a)doesthisblockpork.mindspring.com> wrote in message >>>>>>>>> news:8ucqu55l5m4n1a10quo16vg5gl2jh47jdv(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>>>>> EBS is a three server solution. I have not installed one but I >>>>>>>>>> understand that part of the setup is seeing all three servers at >>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> same time, but I could be wrong. I do not believe you can avoid >>>>>>>>>> three >>>>>>>>>> new servers. I believe part of the process is the new EBS pulls >>>>>>>>>> AD >>>>>>>>>> stuff over and Exchange stuff. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> If you export all of your email, do not care about AD and >>>>>>>>>> workstation >>>>>>>>>> profiles, and are not using Sharepoint then you could backup your >>>>>>>>>> old >>>>>>>>>> SBS, scrap the SBS 2008 and use the old SBS as one of your 3 new >>>>>>>>>> servers. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloadS/details.aspx?familyid=191B141E-3A1F-4C1B-BD2D-15623751E518&displaylang=en >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 14 May 2010 11:44:20 +0100, "John" >>>>>>>>>> <info(a)nospam.infovis.co.uk> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Hi >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Once we run out of 75 license limit of sbs 2008 premium is the >>>>>>>>>>>migration to >>>>>>>>>>>sbs 2008 essential an upgrade or a reinstall of the server is >>>>>>>>>>>required? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Many Thanks >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Regards >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> See what SBS support is working on >>>>>>>>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/default.aspx >>>>>>>>>> Check your SBS with the SBS Best Practices Analyzer >>>>>>>>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/tags/BPA/default.aspx >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>
From: Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] on 16 May 2010 19:44 With small places like 15 it really comes down to what they are spending now and compare. I couldn't give you a number now because Numbers for small businesses varies widely. Especially if they are on a Break fix model. However with 15 you could go to a Foundation server <1k and Cloud The cost of Maintaining and purchasing a SBS server is more than the cost of Simple server BPOS This would give the client a predictable expense. The Area from 15-75 is a mix depending on needs Some need basic file storage and email. However A LOB app depending on what it is can or can not be moved to the cloud. Not all companies grow fast. LOB apps are always an issue always will be. My guess is that Quickbooks is one that will probably switch 100% to cloud next year. (for the Quickbooks business versions) This with Security being impossible to ensure onsite. It is just easier to support for them. My Guess, is there will be a home version CD with less functions etc. I'm not saying all companies can move to the cloud yet, but my guess is it will become too attractive by the end of next year NOT to move to the cloud. Once companies realize support for their LOB will be easier when it is moved to the cloud I'm sure it will happen, (And they will like the subscription income also.) Amazon is working hard on this and MS Azure are two examples. There are lots of companies working on LOB apps on the cloud. The ones that don't switch will fade and have nitch markets compared to now. Just like Lotus 123 and WordPerfect, Didn't see Microsoft as a threat. Russ -- Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com "Kerry Brown" <kerry(a)kdbNOSPAMsys-tems.c*a*m> wrote in message news:eRsWZ6U9KHA.3840(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >> My clients that are on SBS right now, and are getting to end of life on >> hardware. >> I'm moving them to BPOS, because I can't rightfully justify an onsite >> exchange server. >> The value added from on site, and the cost just doesn't pan out.... >> >> Clients want Constant reoccurring costs that don't vary from year to >> year. >> >> Yes I will make more money if I push a Exchange server on them. >> But I can't honestly tell them this, >> when there is a cheaper more reliable solution... BPOS >> >> I urge you with doubts, to actually check out BPOS you can get a free >> account at >> www.BPOSMadeEasy.com >> >> Once you hook it up, I highly doubt if you can tell the difference >> between local exchange and remote? >> (Because it's RPC over HTTPS) >> > > Some clients want constant reoccurring costs, some don't. If you think the > costs won't vary from year to year then I'd urge you to look at the mobile > phone or cable TV industries. > > You (and others) keep saying the cloud will save a small business money > but you don't provide figures. When I work the numbers, which I already > posted, it doesn't work out that way. Can you point me to a study or > provide some numbers to prove show how a small business with fifteen users > and two LOB apps will save money by switching to BPOS or any other cloud > solution? > > I have checked out BPOS. It works great. It is almost exactly the same > experience as an on site Exchange server. The user experience I have no > problem with. For me it all comes down to numbers and I haven't seen > numbers that work for small business. > > You seem to think I'm resistant to or against the cloud. I'm not. I see a > huge future for the cloud, especially for LOB apps. I am resistant to > moving my clients to something that I think will cost them more money for > the same experience they have now. If that changes or someone shows me my > figures are wrong I would recommend they switch immediately. As it is now > the cloud is immature and expensive. When it's mature and inexpensive I > fully expect to be recommending it. > > -- > Kerry Brown > MS-MVP - Windows Desktop Experience: Systems Administration > http://www.vistahelp.ca/phpBB2/ > > > >
From: Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] on 16 May 2010 19:55 I hope you are right... Time will tell Russ -- Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message news:OeNZe8U9KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > Unfortunately you are missing my point. > > That 1.5 billion is not an accurate comparison on what MS is betting on > *for* the cloud. A few examples of what gets counted in that 1.5 Billion: > > XBox Live. This is a HUGE service with millions of daily users. That is > a lot of servers, a lot of salaries, and a lot of regular upgrades. That > costs money. It is a cloud service. But it is COMPLEMENTARY to the XBox > devices and does not compete with them. It drives sales of the hardware, > games, and licensing fees MS charges developers. But when counting money > spent on the cloud, everything spent on XBox Live counts. > > Zune Marketplace. Now, maybe the Zune standalone player will not survive > the MS cutbacks. Maybe it will. Who knows. But as of right now, > portable music still needs some sort of device. Whether it is a zune > player, a phone-like device (I'm thinking of the recently released Kin > devices) or Windows Phone 7, the Zune brand would not do well solely in > the cloud. It's major selling point is that it complements portable > music, just like iTunes complements iPods. Yet, the Zune service is "in > the cloud" and thus every penny spent on it counts. > > Hotmail. Yes, because we are an SBS newsgroup, we discuss Exchange and, > by proxy, hosted Exchange services are bound to get discussed...including > Exchange Defender and BPOS. But if hosted Exchange is counted as "cloud" > spending, then certainly hotmail is as well. But MS has had Hotmail for > *YEARS* and it has not threatened their desktop email client (Outlook > Express turned Windows Mail in Vista turned Windows Live Mail). The two > complement each other. Sometimes people just want to be able to archive > and read mail offline. > > So, to recap, yes the cloud is a "direction" and not a side-road. But it > is not the ONLY direction. MS is big enough to bet on multiple > technologies, integrate them where it makes sense, and discard them where > they don't fit or fail to meet expectations or demand...think of the > hosted Silverlight platform that MS offered free space on for awhile. MS > had no problems canning *that* and if they were really thinking "cloud no > matter what" then that service would have continued despite its > shortcomings. > > One final note: As far as the "we all lose," I couldn't disagree more. > When MS diversifies, whether you are an MS partner or an MS end-user, it > gives you a chance to use their new products and/or services where it > makes sense. If you are a partner, you now have new things to sell. If > you put all your eggs in one basket and they pull the plug, yes you will > lose. But that is like betting on one number in roulette (I wanted to get > back to that analogy.) However most consultants and value-added companyes > (resellers, consultants, service providers, etc) sell not just MS, but > Cisco, Calyptix, 3CX, and other products and services to allow themselves > in maneuverability in offering the best solution for their customers. If > MS gets into a new market and can offer a compelling solution by betting > on a new market segment, WE also win if it succeeds because we can now > offer our services in that market (if your business plan executes it > properly. > > Similarly, if you are an end-user of MS products, presumably the reason > you'd switch to a new technology is because it offers more value for your > dollar. That I also a win for the consumer as they get a better solution > than they had before. > > Now, to stick with that analogy to the very end, yes...it is still a bet > and one can still lose. I'm sure there are companies that bought into EBS > that are now looking at spending more money on labor for migrations off of > EBS than they originally planned. So, I'm not saying that betting with MS > is always a way to win. What I am saying is that you don't have to view > MS's desire to spend money on the cloud as adversarial. You can make the > most of the situation, align yourself with their products and services > where it complements your own business, and where it doesn't...look at > competitors. And, to bring it full circlue, you don't have to assume that > because MS is playing in a new market (the cloud) that they are going to > abandon their steadfast money-making markets. They *can* (and in most > cases WILL) co-exist, fulfilling different needs for different types of > customers. The best consultants will know when to leverage each, and I > think MS knows this and will keep their products on-site where it makes > sense (in other words, Exchange ain't goin nowhere soon. It CERTAINLY has > a place in the enterprise for a LOOOOONNNNNNGGGGGG time to come. By > proxy, SBS is built from the variosu enterprise components, so integrating > new versions is not *that* much of a financial dis-incentive for MS. As > long as SBS keeps selling more than it costs to develop, I'd expect MS to > keep developing new versions. > > -Cliff > > > "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message > news:urC#R0T9KHA.4768(a)TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... >> Well with 1.5Billion going to be invested by Microsoft >> and Billions from others in the same game... >> >> If it is a roulette table, we will all lose.... >> >> Just look at where Microsoft Server technology is going? >> Software Technology? All pointing to the cloud.... >> >> It's a Direction, not a side road..... >> >> Software will be 'on-demand' >> Servers will be cloud, with pay for what you need... >> >> Microsoft will be a utility company.... just like your TV phone and >> internet. >> (Just my opinion.) >> >> Russ >> >> -- >> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >> >> >> "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >> news:95E7DEBF-17E2-4BE7-A0C9-1B24CC4BC793(a)microsoft.com... >>> True, but MS doesn't play "war" (top card wins.) They play roulette and >>> spread their bets. Good examples: >>> >>> XBox. They bet on HD-DVD over blu-ray (and lost) but also bet on >>> streaming video with their own marketplace (successful) and the first >>> (and still the only disc-less as far as I know) streaming netflix >>> console. >>> >>> Office 2010: Online *and* client-based. >>> >>> VoIP: ResponsePoint *and* Office Communications Server. Not related >>> technologies. >>> >>> Cloud storage: Skydrive *and* Mesh. So far, still two separate >>> entities. >>> >>> Email: BPOS *and* Exchange (they did ship 2010, and didn't go strictly >>> cloud.) >>> >>> ================ >>> >>> So by my observations, yes MS is betting heavily on the cloud. BUT >>> pundits are adding an inaccurate and unspoken "only" in that sentence. >>> They are implying that "MS is betting on *only* the cloud" and that >>> there is some future where stand-alone boxes (whether it be PC, a >>> dedicated video or gaming device, or mobile device) ceases to matter. >>> And I argue exactly the opposite. The cloud is complementary to >>> stand-alone devices. I think Exchange has a long future ahead yet. >>> >>> -Cliff >>> >>> >>> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in message >>> news:41B9A93F-5CFC-4489-805D-1356EF3148BA(a)microsoft.com... >>>> Well Microsoft is betting 1.5Billion on it... :) >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>>> >>>> >>>> "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>>> news:093CAB9B-407E-4D45-A515-F3D068826A0C(a)microsoft.com... >>>>> I'll take that bet. I think there is a looming backlash against "the >>>>> cloud" because of reliability and privacy concerns. >>>>> >>>>> -Cliff >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in >>>>> message news:u93fU#78KHA.1892(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>>> BPOS is basically RPC over HTTPS so its nothing new. >>>>>> >>>>>> and Because of the cost difference there will be more an more people >>>>>> moving >>>>>> and yes you are right Exchange on site will be dead IMO soon. >>>>>> And there is a lot of kick from IT >>>>>> But Money talks >>>>>> Financially it's too expensive to run an exchange server.. :( >>>>>> I predict in 4-5 years exchange will no longer be onsite... >>>>>> Russ >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>>>>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>>>>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>>>>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> "Charlie Russel - MVP" <Charlie(a)mvKILLALLSPAMMERSps.org> wrote in >>>>>> message news:OdOVq678KHA.4600(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >>>>>>> Sorry, BPOS will never be my first choice. Frankly, I don't want >>>>>>> anyone else with their hands in my pocket every single month or my >>>>>>> business is dead. My monthly nut is quite large enough, without >>>>>>> adding to it. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Charlie. >>>>>>> http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Russ SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP]" <russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz> wrote in >>>>>>> message news:FF17FB09-16D8-4DC1-AE0C-EA10F3662BFE(a)microsoft.com... >>>>>>>>I know this is a Sales Pitch >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> but this would be a great time to move to BPOS >>>>>>>> You'd just need 1 Server for Files >>>>>>>> and one for any LOB >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> SharePoint and Exchange would be in the cloud >>>>>>>> visit www.BPOSMadeEasy.com >>>>>>>> or a search for bpos on the web >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Or contact me offline russgrover @ kaitka.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It's cheaper to have exchange in the cloud than on premises now >>>>>>>> days :( >>>>>>>> Russ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Russell Grover - SBITS.Biz [SBS-MVP] >>>>>>>> MCP, MCPS, MCNPS, SBSC >>>>>>>> Small Business Server/Computer Support - www.SBITS.Biz >>>>>>>> BPOS - Microsoft Online Services - >>>>>>>> www.Microsoft-Online-Services.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> "Charlie Russel - MVP" <Charlie(a)mvKILLALLSPAMMERSps.org> wrote in >>>>>>>> message news:OBQFtv28KHA.2248(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>>>>>> Plus I'm not at all sure I'd choose to move to EBS at this point, >>>>>>>>> given that the product has been discontinued. A simple move off of >>>>>>>>> SBS to "normal" Windows Server + Exchange could be done on fewer >>>>>>>>> servers and with less pain, and would not have one looking at a >>>>>>>>> potential second migration later. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Charlie. >>>>>>>>> http://msmvps.com/blogs/russel >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> "Cliff Galiher - MVP" <cgaliher(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >>>>>>>>> news:e8s4Qu18KHA.2248(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>>>>>>> You are correct. The three servers are installed individually, >>>>>>>>>> not simultaneously. The third server to be installed is the >>>>>>>>>> messaging server, so to migrate exchange, SBS must still be >>>>>>>>>> available *after* the installation of the third server completes. >>>>>>>>>> Virtualizing can, of course, keep the physical hardware count >>>>>>>>>> down, but careful considerations must be made when deciding to >>>>>>>>>> virtualize. There are trade-offs. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -Cliff >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> "Jim Behning SBS MVP" >>>>>>>>>> <jimbehning(a)doesthisblockpork.mindspring.com> wrote in message >>>>>>>>>> news:8ucqu55l5m4n1a10quo16vg5gl2jh47jdv(a)4ax.com... >>>>>>>>>>> EBS is a three server solution. I have not installed one but I >>>>>>>>>>> understand that part of the setup is seeing all three servers at >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> same time, but I could be wrong. I do not believe you can avoid >>>>>>>>>>> three >>>>>>>>>>> new servers. I believe part of the process is the new EBS pulls >>>>>>>>>>> AD >>>>>>>>>>> stuff over and Exchange stuff. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> If you export all of your email, do not care about AD and >>>>>>>>>>> workstation >>>>>>>>>>> profiles, and are not using Sharepoint then you could backup >>>>>>>>>>> your old >>>>>>>>>>> SBS, scrap the SBS 2008 and use the old SBS as one of your 3 new >>>>>>>>>>> servers. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.microsoft.com/downloadS/details.aspx?familyid=191B141E-3A1F-4C1B-BD2D-15623751E518&displaylang=en >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 14 May 2010 11:44:20 +0100, "John" >>>>>>>>>>> <info(a)nospam.infovis.co.uk> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>Hi >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>Once we run out of 75 license limit of sbs 2008 premium is the >>>>>>>>>>>>migration to >>>>>>>>>>>>sbs 2008 essential an upgrade or a reinstall of the server is >>>>>>>>>>>>required? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>Many Thanks >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>Regards >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> See what SBS support is working on >>>>>>>>>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/default.aspx >>>>>>>>>>> Check your SBS with the SBS Best Practices Analyzer >>>>>>>>>>> http://blogs.technet.com/sbs/archive/tags/BPA/default.aspx >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>
From: Leythos on 16 May 2010 20:59
In article <OiRZMdR9KHA.3880(a)TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl>, russ(a)REMOVETHIS.sbits.biz says... > > You should really check facts before you post. > I read the faq and other information at the official MS site, their information, on the faq, in multiple locations states 6AM to 18:00 PACIFIC TIME - who am I to believe if not themselves? -- You can't trust your best friends, your five senses, only the little voice inside you that most civilians don't even hear -- Listen to that. Trust yourself. spam999free(a)rrohio.com (remove 999 for proper email address) |