Imac in one room, speaker(s) another
in [Mac Systems]
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From: Robert Montgomery on 7 Nov 2009 23:46 Michelle Steiner wrote: > In article <S0ZGm.49995$Db2.13603(a)edtnps83>, > Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: > >> After 102 messages have been written in this thread, we still have at >> least two of the top-tier experts here (Sander and Michele) who don't >> fully understand the situation, > > The problem is largely due to the fact that you have not clearly explained > the situation. Perhaps I didn't fully explain the situation initially due to my lack of technical expertise, but the contributors here have had plenty of opportunities to find out subsequently what my situation is, because I write well and I've been eager to answer the questions posed so that I can solve this vexing problem. We've now had about 120 messages in this thread, and even now you've written that you're not sure if my D-Link 604+ base station is Airtunes compatible and it's not known if my Airtunes port is blocked on the router, so if there's a lack of clarity, it's not all my fault. And you may have noticed that – as usually and inevitably occurs because people can['t agree on anything – there's been much conflicting advice, which naturally complicates the situation and causes me to change my planned course of action frequently. > To get airtunes to work, the computer, the router/base-station, and the > Airport Express must all be on the same network. That means that the > router and the Airport Express must be connected to each other, either via > an ethernet cable or via WiFi. And the router must be compatible with > airtunes. Also, if there is any encryption required by the router (WEP or > WPA), the Airport Express must be configured with the right password. > > I don't know whether the router is compatible with airtunes. I don't know > whether you have airtunes' port blocked on the router. How could I find out if I have Airtunes's port blocked by the router? Or is it beyond my ken to find out? > I do know that your router is 802.11b, which is the slowest WiFi > connection, and may not be airtunes capable. > > You would probably be best off (except financially, because "buying" > involves spending money) buying a new router/base station. The two best > options are the Airport Extreme and another Airport Express. > > The Extreme is more expensive than the Express, but the Express would > require you connect the Mac as well as the airtunes Express via wifi, > because it has only one ethernet port. The Extreme would allow you to > connect either or both via ethernet or wifi (or mix one of each), but is > more expensive. I'm considering buy a second Express, but I'm concerned, because you just wrote that my D-Link 604+ router, which is 802.11b, may not be Airtunes compatible, so you've implied that even with a second Express, I might still have problems. Robert
From: Robert Montgomery on 7 Nov 2009 23:52 David Empson wrote: > Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: > >> David Empson wrote: >>> Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: >>> >>>> David Empson wrote: >>>> >>>>> What sort of connection does your D-Link have to the Internet? >>>> How can I find out? I checked my router's configuration data in a >>>> browser, and System Profiler, but I can't translate the geekese there >>>> into regular English. >>> How does it physically plug into the Internet? What sort of cable is >>> used between the D-Link and the Internet, and what is the socket on the >>> D-Link labelled? >> The socket is labeled "ADSL". The cord in that socket is a phone cord, >> which leads to a five-way phone jack splitter. The main cord of the >> phone jack splitter leads to a phone jack in a wall. > > Good, that is enough information to confirm your D-Link is a DSL router. > > (ADSL, as it happens, which is one of the many variants of DSL and > probably still the most common one. ADSL stands for "Asymmetric Digital > Subscriber Line" - the Asymmetric bit means it is faster for downloading > than for uploading.) > > An Airport Extreme cannot directly replace your D-Link. You will still > need some device to act as an ADSL modem, because the Airport Extreme > does not include that feature. > > Your best option would be to replace the D-Link with a more modern ADSL > modem/router which includes a better implementation of WiFi, > particularly support for 802.11g, and WPA/WPA2 encryption. > > If you are getting a new ADSL modem/router it would be a good idea to > confirm the new one supports ADSL2+, which is a more recent standard > that allows faster Internet connections, but only if you are close > enough to the exchange or roadside cabinet (based on length of the > telephone line between the exchange and your house), and only if your > Telco supports ADSL2+. ADSL2+ is fully compatible with older versions of > ADSL. > > The other option is to keep using your D-Link and attach another device > to it via Ethernet. That other device will act as your main wireless > base station. Another Airport Express is sufficient for this task. > >>> Note the subtle difference between telephone sockets and Ethernet >>> sockets. The US uses RJ-11 (six pin) telephone sockets, though only two >>> of those pins are used. Ethernet uses RJ-45 (eight pin) sockets which >>> are similar in appearance but wider. >> I see what you mean. Thanks for the detailed explanation. Only one of >> the four Ethernet sockets is used. It's got a cable leading to my Imac. > > Good, that is what I expected based on earlier discussion. > > With my suggestion of adding a second Airport Express, you would plug it > into one of the remaining Ethernet sockets in the D-Link. The iMac would > remain connected as it is now. > > The resulting network would look like this: > > Room 1 > ====== > > Phone > Line > | > | > (ADSL) > | > | > D-Link DSL-604+ > | | | | > | | | +-----(Ethernet)-----iMac > | | | > | | +-------(Ethernet)-----Airport Express (A) > | | > (2 spare Ethernet sockets) > > > Room 2 > ====== > > Airport Express (B) ----(Audio)----> to stereo > > PC > > Both devices in Room 2 are connected wirelessly to the network created > by Airport Express (A). > > As long as Airport Express (B) is the current model (which supports > 802.11n), its Ethernet socket can also be used to connect another device > to the network via Ethernet, without having to run a long Ethernet cable > through to the D-Link. Any such device will make use of the wireless > connection between the two Airport Expresses. > > (That device could be an Ethernet switch. I use a very similar > configuration where my "room 2" is my dining/entertainment room.) > > > If you choose to replace the D-Link with a more modern ADSL > modem/router/WiFi base station, you won't need Airport Express (A), and > the replacement for the D-Link will be creating the wirless network. > Everything else remains the same. > > > Assuming you go with the dual Airport Express configuration, then the > key details you need to set this up are: > > 1. Under the Airport/Wireless settings on Airport Express (A), Wireless > Mode must be set to "Create a wireless network". Set up security options > as you see fit. I recommend WPA/WPA2 Personal. > > 2. Under the Internet settings on Airport Express (A), Connection > Sharing should be "Off (Bridge Mode)". This disables the router and DHCP > server in the Airport Express. With this confguration, your D-Link is > the router and DHCP server, and you don't want the Airport Express to be > one as well. > > 3. Under the Airport/Wireless settings on Airport Express (B), Wireless > Mode must be set to "Join a wireless network", choosing the wireless > network created by Airport Express (A). (This automatically disables > routing features in Airport Express (B).) > > 4. The PC must be set to join the wireless network created by Airport > Express (A). > > 5. The iMac must have Internet Sharing turned off, and its Airport must > also be turned off. The iMac will talk to Airport Express (B) for audio > output by going through the Ethernet to D-Link, Ethernet to Airport > Express (A), then wirelessly to Airport Express (B). You're really good at understanding and explaining these complicated, technical issues, David. Thanks for taking so much time to help me. You would be an excellent technical writer for computer manuals. I assume from what you've written above, that you dismiss Micelle's warning that my router might still cause problems even if I have a second Express in the network, even though it's an 802.11b router instead of 802.11n. Robert
From: Robert Montgomery on 8 Nov 2009 00:43 Michelle Steiner wrote: > In article <6YqJm.51926$PH1.1772(a)edtnps82>, > Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: > >> Michelle Steiner wrote: >>> In article <AQYGm.49993$Db2.32961(a)edtnps83>, >>> Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: >>> >>>> Yes, I'm still using the D-Link. And yes, I configured the Express >>>> correctly. I plugged it into an outlet in a room that's next to the >>>> Imac. I plugged a cord from the Express into the powered speakers. And I >>>> plugged the powered speakers into an outlet. >>> That's a physical connection; it's not a configuration. Configuration is >>> done via software. >> That's false. >> >> The dictionary in my Imac defines configuration as "the arrangement in >> which items of computer hardware or software are interconnected". >> >> Robert > > I agree with those who say that you're a troll. So you're coming up with your own definition of words? How can you imply that the dictionary is wrong? Let's be clear. To be clear, you have to use words that everyone understands. If you're going to come up with your own definitions of words, you're only going to confuse people. And if you then also accuse people of being mischief-makers, if makes you look like a hypocrite. Using terms properly � as defined by dictionaries � is not making mischief. I get the feeling that you have difficulty admitting that you're wrong, and perhaps that rankles you because you don't like being corrected by someone with less technical expertise than you have. Goodness gracious, thicken your skin and be polite. Robert
From: David Empson on 8 Nov 2009 07:20 Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: [Snip DE's detailed description of proposed dual Airport Express configuration] > I assume from what you've written above, that you dismiss Micelle's > warning that my router might still cause problems even if I have a > second Express in the network, even though it's an 802.11b router > instead of 802.11n. It won't cause any problems as long as your configuration is correct. The D-Link's wireless network can simply be ignored. If possible, it would be better to turn it off completely (for security reasons, if nothing else). If you can't turn off the D-Link's wireless network, then you need to do two things: 1. Get the Airport Express to create a wireless network which has a different SSID (name) from the one the D-Link is creating. 2. Set the two wireless networks to run on different channels, to prevent them interfering with each other. The 2.4 GHz channels typically used for 802.11g or 802.11n are 1, 6 and 11. If the D-Link is using channel 1, you could set the Airport Express to use channel 6 (for example). You should probably stick with 2.4 GHz if using a pair of Airport Expresses, because that will be compatible with any computers you want to connect to the network which support 802.11b, 802.11g or 802.11n (more common in general, and all older Macs). As the two Airport Expresses will be in adjacent rooms, you could run them on 802.11n at 5 GHz (range could be a problem if there is more than one wall between them), but the only computers which support 802.11a or 802.11n would be able to connect to the wireless network. It is worth pointing out one advantage of an Airport Extreme here: the current model supports "simultaneous dual-band" operation - it can create networks on both 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz at the same time, for maximum compatibility with all devices you might want to connect to a wireless network. The Airport Express can only operate on one frequency (either 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz), so you have to pick whether to be compatible with 802.11b/g or 802.11a. I doubt the extra cost is worth it just for this reason. The other benefits of the Airport Extreme over a second Airport Express would be: - Probably better wireless coverage throughout the house, due to better antenna configuration in the Airport Extreme. (Not likely to be an issue one room away.) - More Ethernet ports. (You don't need this at the moment because your D-Link will still be in use, but it might be a factor in future if you changed your Internet connection and stopped using the D-Link.) - Supports connection of a hard drive to the USB port. -- David Empson dempson(a)actrix.gen.nz
From: Robert Montgomery on 8 Nov 2009 12:15
David Empson wrote: > Robert Montgomery <info-block(a)northern-data-tech.net> wrote: > > [Snip DE's detailed description of proposed dual Airport Express > configuration] > >> I assume from what you've written above, that you dismiss Michelle's >> warning that my D-Link router might still cause problems even if I have a >> second Express in the network, even though my D-Link an 802.11b router >> instead of 802.11n. > > It won't cause any problems as long as your configuration is correct. > The D-Link's wireless network can simply be ignored. If possible, it > would be better to turn it off completely (for security reasons, if > nothing else). I can turn it off. On the D-Link's router configuarion page, I'd go to the Wireless page > Wireless Connection and press the "Disable" button. Right now the "Enabled" button is chosen. > If you can't turn off the D-Link's wireless network, then you need to do > two things: > > 1. Get the Airport Express to create a wireless network which has a > different SSID (name) from the one the D-Link is creating. > > 2. Set the two wireless networks to run on different channels, to > prevent them interfering with each other. > > The 2.4 GHz channels typically used for 802.11g or 802.11n are 1, 6 and > 11. If the D-Link is using channel 1, you could set the Airport Express > to use channel 6 (for example). It sounds like it would be easier to turn of the D-Link's wireless connection. That way I could use the existing SSID name and one channel instead of adding an SSID name and using a second channel. I assume that this would apply if I buy an Extreme instead of an Express. (I haven't made up my mind yet about which one to buy.) > You should probably stick with 2.4 GHz if using a pair of Airport > Expresses, because that will be compatible with any computers you want > to connect to the network which support 802.11b, 802.11g or 802.11n > (more common in general, and all older Macs). > > As the two Airport Expresses will be in adjacent rooms, you could run > them on 802.11n at 5 GHz (range could be a problem if there is more than > one wall between them), but the only computers which support 802.11a or > 802.11n would be able to connect to the wireless network. The current Airport Express and my Imac are only about three feet apart and there's only one wall separating them, so 5 GHz shouldn't be a problem. > It is worth pointing out one advantage of an Airport Extreme here: the > current model supports "simultaneous dual-band" operation - it can > create networks on both 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz at the same time, for maximum > compatibility with all devices you might want to connect to a wireless > network. > > The Airport Express can only operate on one frequency (either 2.4 GHz or > 5 GHz), so you have to pick whether to be compatible with 802.11b/g or > 802.11a. > > I doubt the extra cost is worth it just for this reason. > > The other benefits of the Airport Extreme over a second Airport Express > would be: > > - Probably better wireless coverage throughout the house, due to better > antenna configuration in the Airport Extreme. (Not likely to be an issue > one room away.) > > - More Ethernet ports. (You don't need this at the moment because your > D-Link will still be in use, but it might be a factor in future if you > changed your Internet connection and stopped using the D-Link.) > > - Supports connection of a hard drive to the USB port. Thanks a lot, David. Robert |