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From: Jim Thompson on 22 May 2010 11:36 On Fri, 21 May 2010 23:52:50 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell" <mike.terrell(a)earthlink.net> wrote: > >"krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" wrote: >> >> Michael A. Terrell wrote: >> > >> > Pools have to be inside a locked fence around here. >> >> Inground pools do pretty much everywhere. That doesn't remove all liability, >> though. Remember Joerg is in Kalifornia. > > > It's against the law to breath in Kalifornia, and Kalifornia is known >to cause cancer in every living thing. :( SPELL CHECK! It's spelled "Kalifornica", with major fairy city of "San Fransicko". ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, CTO | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | The only thing bipartisan in this country is hypocrisy
From: krw on 22 May 2010 11:36 On Sat, 22 May 2010 08:23:11 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote: >> On Fri, 21 May 2010 17:07:55 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >> >>> krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote: >>>> On Fri, 21 May 2010 08:11:16 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>> >>>>> krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote: >>>>>> On Wed, 19 May 2010 15:38:31 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> krw(a)att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz wrote: >>>>>>>> On Wed, 19 May 2010 06:32:57 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> [...] >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The best sort of mentoring is what some volunteer IEEE members do in >>>>>>>>> South America. There, lots of people die from lung diseases because they >>>>>>>>> read using kerosine lamps at night. So they install a few >>>>>>>>> solar-battery-LED thingamagics in the first 2-3 huts while some of the >>>>>>>>> more clever villagers look at how the work is done. Then, they hand the >>>>>>>>> toolbox and the materials for the next dozen huts to the villagers. >>>>>>>> But without food and clean water, reading is a luxury. >>>>>>> Oh, they do have that. Even cerveza, or probably chicha (in Quechua). >>>>>>> Those people have lived there and farmed that sparse and rough terrain >>>>>>> for hundreds of year, but now they want to afford their kids some >>>>>>> education (or maybe have to). They really eke out a meager living, far >>>>>> >from what we are used to. The son of a couple from our church was down >>>>>>> there on a long term technical mission, building stuff etc. He said the >>>>>>> utmost in delicatessen when there is a really important feast was cooked >>>>>>> chicken feet. He really had to get used to some things there. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It's just that there is no electricity within whole swaths of >>>>>>> countryside. Not one lone powerline crossing the mountain ranges. So >>>>>>> those smoke-belching lanterns are their only affordable option. >>>>>> Then these aren't the people (I think) JKK was talking about when he said: >>>>>> >>>>>> "Propping up overpopulation (more than the relevant economy can provide >>>>>> for) strikes me as an error, and poor ethics." >>>>>> >>>>>> They seem to be surviving fine. >>>>> People could, almost everywhere in the world. The main problems are >>>>> unmanaged diseases (like HIV), poorly managed irrigation and farming, >>>>> lack of education, socialist dictators, but foremost hardcore government >>>>> corruption where 90+ percent of the population starve while a few >>>>> percent live high on the hog. Plus, more lately, fundamentalists. >>>> Almost everywhere, agreed. The main issue is socialists, dictators, and >>>> corruption. Without changing these huge issues, you're pissing up a rope. >>>> >>> If all this saves one person's life it was worth it, IMHO. >> >> Even if it kills ten more? >> > >Our help? It never did that. But it does help give people with HIV over >there purpose and later a dignified death, not somewhere alone in the >streets. Your charity isn't in a place where people don't have even the basics for life. The point is that there are places that helping a little can do more long-term harm than none at all. That's where the ethical issues come into play. If condoms, for instance, allow the sexual lifestyles continue unaltered, is that a good thing? ...even if it saves one person's life? There are tough ethical choices. We tend to not be so good at seeing unintended consequences, either (and worse, liberals ignore the them even after they become obvious).
From: Charlie E. on 22 May 2010 11:45 On Fri, 21 May 2010 18:49:21 -0700, dplatt(a)radagast.org (Dave Platt) wrote: >In article <85opv1Fl1oU1(a)mid.individual.net>, >Joerg <news(a)analogconsultants.com> wrote: > >>> "Floating cover"? We had a "solar blanket" (heavy duty packing material) for >>> about ten years. ... >> >> >>I think that's what ours was called. Looked like blue bubble wrap. When >>it lost its "blueishness" it began to flake stuff into the pool. > >Yeah, we use one like that. Or, rather, we use one of those every 2-3 >years... that's about all they're good for, in practice. The >"warranty" is for five years, but it's voided if you expose them to >more than about 1 PPM of chlorine in the pool water. I considered >switching to one of the non-chlorine systems to preserve the cover, >but the most popular one (Bacquil) isn't compatible with roof-mounted >solar pool heating systems as it'll generate massive amounts of >foaming and bubbline. > >The guy at the store recently admitted that nobody gets five years out >of these things, because you can't keep a pool properly and >consistently sanitized with such a low free-chlorine level. This >seems to be especially true at the higher water temperatures that >these covers are intended to provide... we run our pool near the >cover's rated upper temperature limit of 90 F (my wife likes to swim >in soup... it's so warm I start overheating if I swim fast laps). > >I just consider the cost of the covers to be part of the ongoing >expense of operating the pool. They add a couple of months a year to >the swimming season. I have never seen a temperature or chlorine limit when I purchased my covers, but if they are the limits you say, then it is no wonder mine never last! We hae a salt water chlorine system, but we still periodically shock it with a packet of shock. That probably violates the 1ppm limit. We also get temps of greater than 100 degrees in our water during the summer! I will literally take the cover off, and just add water to let evaporation do its thing to keep it that cool... ;-) Charlie
From: Charlie E. on 22 May 2010 11:47 On Fri, 21 May 2010 17:52:21 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> wrote: >Charlie E. wrote: >> On Fri, 21 May 2010 17:09:39 -0700, Joerg <invalid(a)invalid.invalid> >> wrote: >> >>> Jim Thompson wrote: >>>> On Fri, 21 May 2010 19:48:43 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell" >>>> <mike.terrell(a)earthlink.net> wrote: >> <snip> >> >>>> Yep. I've contemplated a powered one that forms a usable deck. >>>> >>> Ah, I see. You invite folks from this here NG and seat the not so nice >>> fellahs on that "usable deck", then go inside and press magic button ... >>> *SPLOSH* :-) >> >> Bach when I was going to UCSB, one of my teachers had us up to his >> house one weekend, and showed us HIS pool cover. It was two patio >> covers made from wood and corrugated fiberglass panels that >> cantelevered down to cover the pool, and then came up to provide shade >> when you wanted to use the pool! >> > >Wow! The lumber alone much have cost him north of $3k. > > >> Unfortunately, a week later, the fires came and took the entire >> home... :-( >> > >:-( The pool wasn't that big, so the covers were each probably 10x30 feet. the interesting thing was the hydralics to lift and lower it! Charlie
From: krw on 22 May 2010 11:57
On Sat, 22 May 2010 08:45:57 -0700, Charlie E. <edmondson(a)ieee.org> wrote: >On Fri, 21 May 2010 18:49:21 -0700, dplatt(a)radagast.org (Dave Platt) >wrote: > >>In article <85opv1Fl1oU1(a)mid.individual.net>, >>Joerg <news(a)analogconsultants.com> wrote: >> >>>> "Floating cover"? We had a "solar blanket" (heavy duty packing material) for >>>> about ten years. ... >>> >>> >>>I think that's what ours was called. Looked like blue bubble wrap. When >>>it lost its "blueishness" it began to flake stuff into the pool. >> >>Yeah, we use one like that. Or, rather, we use one of those every 2-3 >>years... that's about all they're good for, in practice. The >>"warranty" is for five years, but it's voided if you expose them to >>more than about 1 PPM of chlorine in the pool water. I considered >>switching to one of the non-chlorine systems to preserve the cover, >>but the most popular one (Bacquil) isn't compatible with roof-mounted >>solar pool heating systems as it'll generate massive amounts of >>foaming and bubbline. >> >>The guy at the store recently admitted that nobody gets five years out >>of these things, because you can't keep a pool properly and >>consistently sanitized with such a low free-chlorine level. This >>seems to be especially true at the higher water temperatures that >>these covers are intended to provide... we run our pool near the >>cover's rated upper temperature limit of 90 F (my wife likes to swim >>in soup... it's so warm I start overheating if I swim fast laps). >> >>I just consider the cost of the covers to be part of the ongoing >>expense of operating the pool. They add a couple of months a year to >>the swimming season. > >I have never seen a temperature or chlorine limit when I purchased my >covers, but if they are the limits you say, then it is no wonder mine >never last! We hae a salt water chlorine system, but we still >periodically shock it with a packet of shock. That probably violates >the 1ppm limit. We also get temps of greater than 100 degrees in our >water during the summer! I will literally take the cover off, and >just add water to let evaporation do its thing to keep it that cool... >;-) 1ppm is the minimum of the "safe range". IIRC the recommended chlorine concentration was 1-3ppm. Living in NY the pool never got to 100F. ;-) I would regulate the temperature with the filter and solar cover, though. In the spring and fall I'd run the pump in the daytime and leave the cover on when the pool wasn't in use. In the summer the cover was rarely on and if the pool got above 82F (I preferred it about 76-78F in most weather) I'd switch to running the filter at night. I could move the water temperature about 4F with the timing of the filter (X-10 control came in handy). |