Does God need to prove He exists?
in [Physics]
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From: rbwinn on 16 Jul 2008 15:19 On Jul 15, 7:16 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > rbwinn wrote: > > On Jul 15, 1:04 am, "Steve O" <nospamh...(a)thanks.com> wrote: > >> "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > > >>news:a3c2b9ae-59ae-4bfd-b7cf-fcda98b26225(a)d77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com.... > > >>> On Jul 14, 5:12�pm, "Steve O" <nospamh...(a)thanks.com> wrote: > >>>> "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > >>>>news:44f19f98-4d96-4419-a87a-d6bdbd73f31b(a)c58g2000hsc.googlegroups.com... > >>>>>>> Their idea is that if Hezekiah's tunnel exists, then Harry Potter > >>>>>>> has > >>>>>>> to be true because the train station in London is mentioned in Harry > >>>>>>> Potter. > >>>>>> Exactly. Since we know therefore that harry potter isn't true, the > >>>>>> fact > >>>>>> of hezekiahs tunnel means the bible is obviously false. Since we have > >>>>>> true facts referred to in works of complete fiction. > >>>>>> By your reasoning at least. > >>>>> Well, you have it exactly as atheists have been telling me it is. > >>>>> Don't ask me what it is supposed to mean. > >>>>> Robert B. Winn > >>>> Here is an example of rbwinn's logic. > >>>> Sheep are mentioned in the bible > >>>> Sheep exist today > >>>> The bible is accurate and there is a God > >>>> -- > >>>> Steve O > >>> Well, no, Steve O.  Here is an example.  Atheists were claiming that > >>> nothing existed on earth today that could prove anything in the > >>> Bible.  So I said, What about Hezekiah's tunnel?  These atheists had > >>> never heard of Hezekiah's tunnel.  So after they looked it up, they > >>> said, The fact that a tunnel exists no more proves the Bible to be > >>> true than Harry Potter leaving from the train station in London to go > >>> to wizard's school. > >> Here's where you get confused every time. (or deliberately lie) > >> When they said "nothing exists on earth today that could prove anything in > >> the bible" they were talking about the SPECIAL claims in the bible, not the > >> ordinary mundane things such as tunnels, sheep, goats or shekels. > >> Yet, for some reason, you choose to lie about this and attribute claims to > >> atheists which  don't exist. > >> You are either a complete liar or you are stuck on stupid. > > >> -- > >> Steve O > >> a.a. #2240 (Apatheist Chapter) > >> B.A.A.W.A. > >> Convicted by Earthquack > >> Exempt from purgatory by papal indulgence > > >>>  I really believe that it certainly does prove certain verses in the > >>> Old Testament to be true which describe the digging of Hezekiah's > >>> tunnel.  Otherwise, atheists need to explain why there is a tunnel > >>> exactly where the Bible in three books of the Old Testament says a > >>> tunnel was dug as a conduit for water. > >>> Robert B. Winn- Hide quoted text - > >> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> - Show quoted text - > > > Well, the construction of Hezekiah's tunnel was very remarkable.  But > > atheists do not like seeing remards about it.  Why is that? > > Which atheist?  Names, Bobby.  Even nicknames'll do. > > -- > ****************************************************** > *      DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226       * > *----------------------------------------------------* > * "I distrust those people who know so well what God * > *  wants them to do because I notice it always    * > *  coincides with their own desires."         * > *                 --Susan B. Anthony * > ******************************************************- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - Well, I would say all atheists. If you run ito one that wants to talk about Hezekiah's tunnel, let me know. Robert B. Winn
From: rbwinn on 16 Jul 2008 15:22 On Jul 15, 7:49 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" <alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: > On Jul 16, 12:08 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: > > > > > > > On Jul 15, 12:57 am, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" > > > <alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: > > > On Jul 15, 3:58 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: > > > > > On Jul 14, 8:30�pm, "Smiler" <Smi...(a)Joe.King.com> wrote: > > > > > > "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > > > > > >news:66e61aa9-559f-4671-a2ea-6bc1905bebe9(a)a70g2000hsh.googlegroups..com... > > > > > On Jul 13, 6:28?pm, "Smiler" <Smi...(a)Joe.King.com> wrote: > > > > > > > "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > > > > > > >news:fc9d57b1-a5d8-4dea-b10c-2de186d77c39(a)m36g2000hse.googlegroups.com... > > > > > > On Jul 12, 5:43?pm, "Smiler" <Smi...(a)Joe.King.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > > > > > > > >news:43c4adf8-d379-4a72-815c-bc35c1c84eaf(a)b1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > > > > > > > On Jul 11, 5:04?pm, "Smiler" <Smi...(a)Joe.King.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > > > > > > > > >news:6ebcae55-3c20-4ea3-960e-25f802c31860(a)s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... > > > > > > > > On Jul 10, 8:51?pm, "Smiler" <Smi...(a)Joe.King.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > > > > > > > > > >news:1b629e70-db18-4208-a3da-4381dcebabb4(a)p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com... > > > > > > > > > On Jul 8, 8:45?pm, ben_dolan_...(a)reet.com (Ben Dolan) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > There were some atheists who said Harry Potter went on the train > > > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > London to wizard's school. > > > > > > > > > > > And once again, child, you have confused fiction with reality... > > > > > > > > > > Harry Potter is fiction. ?The woman who wrote the books said it was > > > > > > > > > fiction. ?I know this may come as a shock to atheists. > > > > > > > > > =================================== > > > > > > > > > > The bible is also fiction. We don't even know who wrote it. > > > > > > > > > I know this may come as a shock to christians. > > > > > > > > > Get over it. > > > > > > > > > No, Smiler, the Bible tells about the construction of Hezekiah's > > > > > > > > tunnel. ? Didn't we discuss this before. > > > > > > > > ================================ > > > > > > > > And the Harry Potter books tell us about Kings Cross station and > > > > > > > > London. > > > > > > > > Both the Harry Potter books and the bible are fiction. > > > > > > > > Get over it. > > > > > > > > > Smiler, > > > > > > > > If you want to believe that the Bible is fiction, it seems to me that > > > > > > > you are free to believe that the Bible is fiction. ?I will tell you > > > > > > > what. ?Why don't you decide for yourself what you believe, and I will > > > > > > > decide for myself what I believe? ?Does this seem unfair to you? > > > > > > > ============================================== > > > > > > > Not unfair if you keep your stupid beliefs out of a.a. > > > > > > > > Smiler, > > > > > > > The godless one > > > > > > > a.a.# 2279- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > > > As I said, take sci.physics and sci.physics relativity out of the > > > > > > header. > > > > > > ==================================== > > > > > > That won't stop your stupid comments from appearing in a.a., will it. > > > > > > You take a.a. out of your header. > > > > > > Think about it, Smiler. �I am not going to go to alt.atheism. �I have > > > > > no interest in atheists. > > > > > ============================ > > > > > Then why do your lying posts appear in a.a., LIAR? > > > > > > Smiler, > > > > > The godless one > > > > > a.a.# 2279- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > > Because you have not yet taken sci.physics and sci.physics relativity > > > > out of the header. > > > > Robert B. Winn > > > > To remove your posts from alt.atheism, you would need to take a.a out > > > of your headers.  Us changing ours isn't going to change yours. > > > Are you going to stop lying soon? > > > > Al- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > If you are not posting in sci.physics and sci.physics.relativity, then > > I will never see your posts. > > Robert B. Winn > > We don't care if you see our posts.  We care that appropriate answers > are given to your lies in the forum the lies are posted in.  Secondary > to that, is a wish that you will go away and stop posting to > alt.atheism. > > Al- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - Well, I will believe that when you take sci.physics and sci.physics.relativity out of the header. Robert b. Winn
From: rbwinn on 16 Jul 2008 15:35 On Jul 15, 11:16 pm, The Natural Philosopher <a...(a)b.c> wrote: > rbwinn wrote: > > On Jul 14, 11:29 pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > >> rbwinn wrote: > >>> On Jul 14, 8:01�am, The Loan Arranger <no...(a)nowhere.invalid> wrote: > >>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>> Only an atheist would want all choices made for > >>>>> them. > >>>> Now there was me thinking that that was the mark of a worshipper. It > >>>> seems to me that atheists make their own choices, because they don't > >>>> have decisions ready-dictated to them. > >>> So you think it is a mistake to decide ahead of time not to commit > >>> murder, not to steal, to attend church, not to commit adultery, etc. > >> Why would you be so morally deficient so as to need to perform morning > >> affirmations in order not to kill people? > > >> My moral decisions are made as the occasion demands it. Seems to work okay. > > > So are you saying that for each person you encounter, you make a > > decision to kill or not to kill? > > Only if you BELIEVE that everything a person does is dictated by his > choices. > That is what I believe. I came to that conclusion while I was incarcerated in a V.A. hospital psychiatric ward. I could not walk, could not talk, was given another shot of thorazine every night by the nursing assistants, and it was starting to look to me as though I would never get out of there. As I was contemplating my situation, a thought that did not come from me went through my mind, Whatever you see before you at any given time is the result of all choices you have made up to that time. It was at that time that I decided to choose to get out of that mental hospital. It took quite a while, but I did it. A lot of my fellow patients did not. Many of them are probably still there. To me they did not seem to be all that insane when they would arrive at the hospital, just sort of average people with a military background who had done something that brought atheistic attention to themselves. Then they would start to give them drugs. Within a short time it was plain to see that some of them were going to spend the rest of their lives there. Robert B. Winn
From: rbwinn on 16 Jul 2008 15:37 On Jul 15, 11:45�pm, Linda Fox <linda...(a)ntlworld.com> wrote: > On Tue, 15 Jul 2008 19:08:58 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> > wrote: > > >If you are not posting in sci.physics and sci.physics.relativity, then > >I will never see your posts. > > And neither will anyone else who is getting these fascinating > exchanges through the physics ngs. Why should he stop communicating > with the rest of them because _you_ don't want to read them? > > Linda ff Well, for one thing, discussions of atheism are off topic in science newsgroups. Robert B. Winn
From: rbwinn on 16 Jul 2008 15:40
On Jul 15, 11:57 pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > rbwinn wrote: > > On Jul 14, 11:23 pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > >> rbwinn wrote: > >>> On Jul 14, 5:12�pm, "Steve O" <nospamh...(a)thanks.com> wrote: > >>>> "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message > >>>>news:44f19f98-4d96-4419-a87a-d6bdbd73f31b(a)c58g2000hsc.googlegroups.com... > >>>>>>> Their idea is that if Hezekiah's tunnel exists, then Harry Potter has > >>>>>>> to be true because the train station in London is mentioned in Harry > >>>>>>> Potter. > >>>>>> Exactly. Since we know therefore that harry potter isn't true, the fact > >>>>>> of hezekiahs tunnel means the bible is obviously false. Since we have > >>>>>> true facts referred to in works of complete fiction. > >>>>>> By your reasoning at least. > >>>>> Well, you have it exactly as atheists have been telling me it is. > >>>>> Don't ask me what it is supposed to mean. > >>>>> Robert B. Winn > >>>> Here is an example of rbwinn's logic. > >>>> Sheep are mentioned in the bible > >>>> Sheep exist today > >>>> The bible is accurate and there is a God > >>>> -- > >>>> Steve O > >>> Well, no, Steve O.  Here is an example.  Atheists were claiming that > >>> nothing existed on earth today that could prove anything in the > >>> Bible. > >> And yet you've been unable to produce these mythical posts. Well, you do > >> seem to like myths... > > >>>  So I said, What about Hezekiah's tunnel?  These atheists had > >>> never heard of Hezekiah's tunnel.  So after they looked it up, they > >>> said, The fact that a tunnel exists no more proves the Bible to be > >>> true than Harry Potter leaving from the train station in London to go > >>> to wizard's school. > >> In a slightly mangled sense, yes that was me. I'd never heard of > >> Hezekiah's tunnel. Now I have. I still can't see how it supports the > >> existence of any gods. Assuming it's the same tunnel (which hasn't been > >> established AFAIK), so what? People sometimes write things about stuff.. > >> Does that automatically render it true? > > >>>   I really believe that it certainly does prove certain verses in the > >>> Old Testament to be true which describe the digging of Hezekiah's > >>> tunnel.  Otherwise, atheists need to explain why there is a tunnel > >>> exactly where the Bible in three books of the Old Testament says a > >>> tunnel was dug as a conduit for water. > >> I might point out that the physical evidence doesn't accord well with > >> the account of the tunnel's construction. Even if you're right, it's > >> simply shows that a tunnel was built, not that gods exist. > > >> If you want to infer more than is logical from this, go for it! But to > >> maintain a degree of intellectual honesty, I cannot follow.- Hide quoted text - > > > Well, obviously, you have not studied the history of that time. > > Robert B. Winn > > I haven't much, and yet I still know that. Additionally, the Bible > contains some history, but doesn't qualify as a whole. It's far too > unreliable.- Hide quoted text - > Well, I understan why atheists would want to believe Sennacherib's account of the Assyrian invasion of Judea over the Biblical account, but, obviously, Sennacherib was lying. Chaldean historians agree with the Biblical account. Sennacherib lost his entire army at Jerusalem. Robert b. Winn |