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From: Shmuel Metz on 21 Mar 2010 23:02 In <ho47jj$bj5$9(a)reader1.panix.com>, on 03/21/2010 at 04:33 AM, Paul J Gans <gansno(a)panix.com> said: >Thanks for your input, but I think that you have missed the point. Real >operating systems don't introduce major changes in operations without >*first* making sure that the new features work and that old users have a >clear upgrade path. Can you name a real operating system? Every system that I've worked on has introduced serious incompatibilities in application suites on upgrade, even if the system facilities themselves are transparent. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT <http://patriot.net/~shmuel> Unsolicited bulk E-mail subject to legal action. I reserve the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail. Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+news to contact me. Do not reply to spamtrap(a)library.lspace.org
From: Shmuel Metz on 21 Mar 2010 22:57 In <slrnhq9r1v.e15.houghi(a)penne.houghi>, on 03/20/2010 at 04:39 PM, houghi <houghi(a)houghi.org.invalid> said: >And I can't even be botherd how this devide hurts the Open Source >community. At least 3 groups of people making the same kind of program. I consider the diversity to be one of Linux's[1] strengths. Monocultures are bad. [1] Not just Linux, either. TMTOWTDI. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT <http://patriot.net/~shmuel> Unsolicited bulk E-mail subject to legal action. I reserve the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail. Reply to domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+news to contact me. Do not reply to spamtrap(a)library.lspace.org
From: Eef Hartman on 22 Mar 2010 09:05 Paul J Gans <gansno(a)panix.com> wrote: > I have no doubt that KDE 4.x will work quite well for some value > of x. What I do not like is that I have to sit at 11.1 for months > if not longer waiting for that to happen. > > openSUSE will NEVER be a major desktop contender if it continues > to make its production users be beta testers. ANY Linux release in 2009 (and later) is using KDE 4 now as KDE 3.5 has been declared DEAD by _its_ developers in 2008, they don't even try to get it compiled in newer distribution releases. openSUSE 11.1 was released in dec 2008, as was Slackware 12.2 and both were the last ones to support KDE 3.5. The same goes for kubuntu, the 9.x versions do NOT support KDE 3 anymore (and the ubuntu ones without the k of course uses gnome as the default desktop). For Slackware (13.0) Pat did a last try to get KDE3 compiled and released that as "unsupported, NOT to be changed anymore", so when it doesn't run in 13.1 anymore, bad luck. -- ******************************************************************* ** Eef Hartman, Delft University of Technology, dept. SSC/ICT ** ** e-mail: E.J.M.Hartman(a)tudelft.nl - phone: +31-15-278 82525 ** *******************************************************************
From: Eef Hartman on 22 Mar 2010 09:09 houghi <houghi(a)houghi.org.invalid> wrote: > That is indeed the problem and in my opinion a great part of the fault > is the fact that KDE and GNOME (and XFCE) are treated as different kinds > of Linux programs. In the ubuntu family they're even almost treated as separate distributions: ubuntu with gnome kubuntu with kde xubuntu with xfce although after installing one of them you CAN download the other DE's from their "repo's" (I think they use a different name for it, but it is like the openSUSE repo's). -- ******************************************************************* ** Eef Hartman, Delft University of Technology, dept. SSC/ICT ** ** e-mail: E.J.M.Hartman(a)tudelft.nl - phone: +31-15-278 82525 ** *******************************************************************
From: Eef Hartman on 22 Mar 2010 09:20
houghi <houghi(a)houghi.org.invalid> wrote: > There is no real advantage in doing that. Unfortunatly due to the NVidea > drivers I can't go to CLI with CLT-ALT-F1. :-( That is strange, I'm running NVidia drivers here too, but my text consoles work normally. OK, I disabled (myself) tty1, to save the bootup messages there, but ctrl-alt-f[2-6] all work as expected: root 4243 1 0 Mar17 tty2 00:00:00 /sbin/mingetty tty2 root 4245 1 0 Mar17 tty3 00:00:00 /sbin/mingetty tty3 root 4246 1 0 Mar17 tty4 00:00:00 /sbin/mingetty tty4 root 4249 1 0 Mar17 tty5 00:00:00 /sbin/mingetty tty5 root 4250 1 0 Mar17 tty6 00:00:00 /sbin/mingetty tty6 (as you can see I didn't need them yet since my last reboot on the 17th, but the getty's ARE there - and work). And I'm using NVidia packages: nvidia-gfxG02-kmp-pae-185.18.14_2.6.27.23_0.1-2.2 Fri 24 Jul 2009 11:38:22 AM CEST x11-video-nvidiaG02-185.18.14-2.2 Tue 07 Jul 2009 02:26:42 PM CEST (ok, they haven't been updated in a long time for 11.1, the kernel version in the "kmp" package is still 2.6.27.23, while I'm running ..45, the latest 11.1 updated one). Current version of NVidia is something like 190.53 - but - of course 11.1 will never get updated to that release. -- ******************************************************************* ** Eef Hartman, Delft University of Technology, dept. SSC/ICT ** ** e-mail: E.J.M.Hartman(a)tudelft.nl - phone: +31-15-278 82525 ** ******************************************************************* |