Does God need to prove He exists?
in [Physics]
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From: Steve O on 24 Aug 2008 13:49 "Sam Brown" <sambrown(a)bleusky.net> wrote in message news:X8qdnWhiQtLHmizVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d(a)giganews.com... > Steve O wrote: >> >> >> "Sam Brown" <sambrown(a)bleusky.net> wrote in message >> news:LeSdnRQYEv_5ei3VnZ2dnUVZ_oLinZ2d(a)giganews.com... >>> Smiler wrote: >>> >>>> Sorry, but despite your insane delusions and hollow threats, this is >>>> the only life we have. >>>> Unless, of course, you can show us objective evidence that there are >>>> such things as souls, heaven, hell, gods, spirits, angels and ghosts >>>> (holy or otherwise), apart from by quoting from your book of myths, >>>> fables, contradictions and downright lies, the wholly babble. >>> >>> Once again, I'll repeat myself and say that I'm not in any way trying to >>> change your mind about anything. First and foremost, because I know I >>> cannot change your mind. Even you yourself cannot change your own mind. >>> You didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be an atheist. Just as I >>> didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be a Christian. Those choices were >>> made for us. I am certain that you will remain just as you are at this >>> moment for as long as you live. The only point I'm trying to make is you >>> may not believe anything I, or any other Christian, ever tells you in >>> this lifetime. But, there will come a time when you will believe it, and >>> you will bow your knees before the throne of God. And, it's alright with >>> me if you don't believe what we say, because I know that some people >>> have not been elected by God to receive the gift of salvation. It's sad, >>> but it's true. We may not understand why God does things that way (I >>> know I wouldn't), but then, I'm not infinitely wise either. >>> >>> It's like I'm watching a movie, and all the bad guys seem to be winning. >>> But I'm not upset or discouraged, because I know the good guys are going >>> to win out in the end. You see, that's because I read the book. <G> >> >> Sam, you seem quite reasonable and tolerant for a Christian. (even if you >> do support the idea or eternal damnation for some, you're still quite >> polite about it) >> You are right- we simply don't believe you when you say that there is a >> God and there is salvation. >> Is there any reason why we should? > > No, there really isn't. Heh! Are you sure you're a proper theist? ;-) >And I know why you don't believe in it. > Although, if I were to explain it to you, it would appear as though I > were trying to "preach" to you, and maybe "convert" you. And I know > there's absolutely no point in me trying to do something like that. > So I'm not going to. We both know that would be an utter waste of time. That's okay. I have more respect for people who "just believe" without insisting they are absolutely right or imposing their belief on me or assuming that it applies to me too. > >> (I'm sure you are advanced enough in this discussion to dismiss Pascal as >> irrelevant) >> > > Pascal was on the right track. Perhaps if he'd lived a little while > longer he could have corrected his mistakes. But, we'll never know. > -- Steve O a.a. #2240 (Apatheist Chapter) B.A.A.W.A. Convicted by Earthquack Exempt from purgatory by papal indulgence
From: Steve O on 24 Aug 2008 13:53 "Sam Brown" <sambrown(a)bleusky.net> wrote in message news:X8qdnWliQtLKmizVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d(a)giganews.com... > Yap wrote: >> On Aug 24, 12:45 pm, Sam Brown <sambr...(a)bleusky.net> wrote: >>> Smiler wrote: >>>> Sorry, but despite your insane delusions and hollow threats, this is >>>> the >>>> only life we have. >>>> Unless, of course, you can show us objective evidence that there are >>>> such >>>> things as souls, heaven, hell, gods, spirits, angels and ghosts (holy >>>> or >>>> otherwise), apart from by quoting from your book of myths, fables, >>>> contradictions and downright lies, the wholly babble. >>> Once again, I'll repeat myself and say that I'm not in any way trying to >>> change your mind about anything. First and foremost, because I know I >>> cannot change your mind. Even you yourself cannot change your own mind. >>> You didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be an atheist. Just as I >>> didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be a Christian. Those choices were >>> made for us. I am certain that you will remain just as you are at this >>> moment for as long as you live. The only point I'm trying to make is you >>> may not believe anything I, or any other Christian, ever tells you in >>> this lifetime. But, there will come a time when you will believe it, and >>> you will bow your knees before the throne of God. And, it's alright with >>> me if you don't believe what we say, because I know that some people >>> have not been elected by God to receive the gift of salvation. It's sad, >>> but it's true. We may not understand why God does things that way (I >>> know I wouldn't), but then, I'm not infinitely wise either. >> Well, in replying to your earlier post, I have already said that you >> are actually not that smart. >> This world is real, we are real and live in a physical environ that we >> can love, feel, touch and have desire. >> Your world in the afterlife is purely something un-imaginable; >> therefore has no meaning on human at all. >> Do you underswtand this? >>> It's like I'm watching a movie, and all the bad guys seem to be winning. >>> But I'm not upset or discouraged, because I know the good guys are going >>> to win out in the end. You see, that's because I read the book. <G> >> Yes, hero does not die....but this is exactly what it is....made up by >> human. >> In actual world, you mean people do not die? >> Your book is exactly what it was...made up by ancient human and yet a >> sad modern person like you bought into it? >> What's wrong with your mind (since you seem much more sensible than >> rbwinn) ? >> > > All of your questions will be answered; just not now, but in the future. > Be patient. > How does that statement differentiate you from a fairground fortune teller, Sam? -- Steve O a.a. #2240 (Apatheist Chapter) B.A.A.W.A. Convicted by Earthquack Exempt from purgatory by papal indulgence
From: Steve O on 24 Aug 2008 13:55 "rbwinn" <rbwinn3(a)juno.com> wrote in message news:cf18baf4-83cf-478b-8106-5df6ae7bdc5d(a)z66g2000hsc.googlegroups.com... > On Aug 23, 11:34�pm, Yap <hhyaps...(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> On Aug 24, 12:45�pm, Sam Brown <sambr...(a)bleusky.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> > Smiler wrote: >> > > Sorry, but despite your insane delusions and hollow threats, this is >> > > the >> > > only life we have. >> > > Unless, of course, you can show us objective evidence that there are >> > > such >> > > things as souls, heaven, hell, gods, spirits, angels and ghosts (holy >> > > or >> > > otherwise), apart from by quoting from your book of myths, fables, >> > > contradictions and downright lies, the wholly babble. >> >> > Once again, I'll repeat myself and say that I'm not in any way trying >> > to >> > change your mind about anything. First and foremost, because I know I >> > cannot change your mind. Even you yourself cannot change your own mind. >> > You didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be an atheist. Just as I >> > didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be a Christian. Those choices >> > were >> > made for us. I am certain that you will remain just as you are at this >> > moment for as long as you live. The only point I'm trying to make is >> > you >> > may not believe anything I, or any other Christian, ever tells you in >> > this lifetime. But, there will come a time when you will believe it, >> > and >> > you will bow your knees before the throne of God. And, it's alright >> > with >> > me if you don't believe what we say, because I know that some people >> > have not been elected by God to receive the gift of salvation. It's >> > sad, >> > but it's true. We may not understand why God does things that way (I >> > know I wouldn't), but then, I'm not infinitely wise either. >> >> Well, in replying to your earlier post, I have already said that you >> are actually not that smart. >> This world is real, we are real and live in a physical environ that we >> can love, feel, touch and have desire. >> Your world in the afterlife is purely something un-imaginable; >> therefore has no meaning on human at all. >> Do you underswtand this? >> >> > It's like I'm watching a movie, and all the bad guys seem to be >> > winning. >> > But I'm not upset or discouraged, because I know the good guys are >> > going >> > to win out in the end. You see, that's because I read the book. <G> >> >> Yes, hero does not die....but this is exactly what it is....made up by >> human. >> In actual world, you mean people do not die? >> Your book is exactly what it was...made up by ancient human and yet a >> sad modern person like you bought into it? >> What's wrong with your mind (since you seem much more sensible than >> rbwinn) ?- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > > Well, I tend to think in terms of equations. Your atheistic system is > failing rapidly. You can't get the things done that need to be done. > Robert B. Winn Will someone please explain to me what this "atheistic system" is that Winn keeps going on about, and if it exists, how do I join? -- Steve O a.a. #2240 (Apatheist Chapter) B.A.A.W.A. Convicted by Earthquack Exempt from purgatory by papal indulgence
From: Sam Brown on 24 Aug 2008 17:52 Steve O wrote: > > > "Sam Brown" <sambrown(a)bleusky.net> wrote in message > news:X8qdnWliQtLKmizVnZ2dnUVZ_o3inZ2d(a)giganews.com... >> Yap wrote: >>> On Aug 24, 12:45 pm, Sam Brown <sambr...(a)bleusky.net> wrote: >>>> Smiler wrote: >>>>> Sorry, but despite your insane delusions and hollow threats, this >>>>> is the >>>>> only life we have. >>>>> Unless, of course, you can show us objective evidence that there >>>>> are such >>>>> things as souls, heaven, hell, gods, spirits, angels and ghosts >>>>> (holy or >>>>> otherwise), apart from by quoting from your book of myths, fables, >>>>> contradictions and downright lies, the wholly babble. >>>> Once again, I'll repeat myself and say that I'm not in any way >>>> trying to >>>> change your mind about anything. First and foremost, because I know I >>>> cannot change your mind. Even you yourself cannot change your own mind. >>>> You didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be an atheist. Just as I >>>> didn't actually choose arbitrarily to be a Christian. Those choices >>>> were >>>> made for us. I am certain that you will remain just as you are at this >>>> moment for as long as you live. The only point I'm trying to make is >>>> you >>>> may not believe anything I, or any other Christian, ever tells you in >>>> this lifetime. But, there will come a time when you will believe it, >>>> and >>>> you will bow your knees before the throne of God. And, it's alright >>>> with >>>> me if you don't believe what we say, because I know that some people >>>> have not been elected by God to receive the gift of salvation. It's >>>> sad, >>>> but it's true. We may not understand why God does things that way (I >>>> know I wouldn't), but then, I'm not infinitely wise either. >>> Well, in replying to your earlier post, I have already said that you >>> are actually not that smart. >>> This world is real, we are real and live in a physical environ that we >>> can love, feel, touch and have desire. >>> Your world in the afterlife is purely something un-imaginable; >>> therefore has no meaning on human at all. >>> Do you underswtand this? >>>> It's like I'm watching a movie, and all the bad guys seem to be >>>> winning. >>>> But I'm not upset or discouraged, because I know the good guys are >>>> going >>>> to win out in the end. You see, that's because I read the book. <G> >>> Yes, hero does not die....but this is exactly what it is....made up by >>> human. >>> In actual world, you mean people do not die? >>> Your book is exactly what it was...made up by ancient human and yet a >>> sad modern person like you bought into it? >>> What's wrong with your mind (since you seem much more sensible than >>> rbwinn) ? >>> >> >> All of your questions will be answered; just not now, but in the future. >> Be patient. >> > How does that statement differentiate you from a fairground fortune > teller, Sam? > I'm in cahoots with the Circus Leader, who just happens to know everything. (That'll be a buck and a quarter, please.) :)
From: Smiler on 24 Aug 2008 20:16
rbwinn wrote: > On Aug 23, 5:34?pm, "Smiler" <Smi...(a)Joe.King.com> wrote: >> "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message >> >> news:3855f9f9-4381-46b0-91cd-be39f4c10dc5(a)m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com... >> On Aug 22, 10:59?pm, Yap <hhyaps...(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Aug 23, 8:00?am, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: >> >>>> On Aug 22, 11:03 am, "Steve O" <nospamh...(a)thanks.com> wrote: >> >>>>> "rbwinn" <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in message >> >>>>> news:a7f915bf-c5d9-4a09-b2f6-e875a7c5fac0(a)a70g2000hsh.googlegroups.com... >> >>>>>> On Aug 21, 10:51 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" >>>>>> <alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: >>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2:28 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: >> >>>>>>>> Well, I know you do not discuss the theory of relativity. I >>>>>>>> have seen >>>>>>>> you discuss religion. >>>>>>>> Robert B. Winn >> >>>>>>> I've discussed your attempts to call algebra physics, but no-one >>>>>>> has >>>>>>> discussed relativity except to use the term. >> >>>>>>> Have you seen me discuss religion? What did I say about it. >> >>>>>>> Al >>>>>> Well, basically, you say that you think you have something >>>>>> better, but >>>>>> when asked about what you have, you say that you have the >>>>>> ability to oppose religion. So without religion, what do you >>>>>> have? >>>>>> Robert B. Winn >> >>>>> No religion? >> >>>> Right. ?You do not seem to have anything of your own. >>>> Robert B. Winn- Hide quoted text - >> >>>> - Show quoted text - >> >>> No. >>> All people can live without religion. >>> But religious people, like you, may not be able (or unwilling) to >>> live like ordinary resourceful human. >>> In other words, we don't need god, but certainly god need people, >>> right?- Hide quoted text - >> >>> - Show quoted text - >> >> Wrong. >> >> Yes you are, as usual. >> When the last theist dies, all gods will be consigned to the dustbin >> of history. >> > The actual quote was, The last politician needs to be hung on the guts > of the last preacher. It was said by Guss Hall, leader of the > American Communist Party. As it wasn't a quote (no quote marks), you're wrong as usual. Smiler, The godless one a.a.# 2279 |