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From: Kurt Ullman on 26 Dec 2009 16:56 In article <doraymeRidThis-A81C56.08460927122009(a)news.albasani.net>, dorayme <doraymeRidThis(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: > In article <261220090101408857%aeiou(a)mostly.invalid>, > Mark Conrad <aeiou(a)mostly.invalid> wrote: > > > If I wanted to live in a socialist nanny-state society, > > I would move to a socialist country. > > I meant to comment on this and forgot. You have a very distorted view > indeed. You *are* living in a nanny state because of the drug > prohibition laws where adults are not allowed to do what the hell they > like to their own bodies. The consequences of this are incredibly far > reaching; your courts, jails and hospitals are unnecessarily fuller than > they would be otherwise and by a huge factor. > > Courts and jails certainly. Having worked substance abuse units as an RN in past, I am not remotely sure of the hospitals. Even discounting the costs of stopping if they want to, all of the recreational pharmaceuticals have health concerns. Even, as emerging research is starting to show, marijuana . There are also other social costs in abandoned families, paying for the drug of choice, lost wages and productivity that people studiously ignore. Not saying that WoD is the best answer, just that legalization only substitutes one set of problems for another. -- To find that place where the rats don't race and the phones don't ring at all. If once, you've slept on an island. Scott Kirby "If once you've slept on an island"
From: Jamie Kahn Genet on 26 Dec 2009 18:43 Wes Groleau <Groleau+news(a)FreeShell.org> wrote: > Jamie Kahn Genet wrote: > > Rubbish - there are no waiting lists for critical and emergency cases in > > Canada, the UK, NZ, etc. So long as you or a doctor catches the symptoms > > and you reach a hospital in time, you'll get immediate high quality > > care. It's that very immediate care of such cases that helps cause the > > waiting lists for less serious procedures. What - did you think it was a > > case of first come first served regardless of the ailment? > > What about the waiting times for the appointment that diagnoses > something critical where the patient had thought it was trivial? > > Not that it doesn't happen in USA--I lost a pound a day for two > months before a urine test showed where it was going. The only > reason I had the test was because it was routine when I showed up > at E.R. for something unrelated. The only time I have to wait to see a GP is if I only want to see my own. If I need to see a doctor immediately I can do so the same day, no problem. I just need to say it's serious (and suspect it was - I grant you. But that's no fault of the doc's). Otherwise I might have a wait of one to three days typically. I've never felt that's bad. I can tell you I recently got a Doctor's appointment on the 23rd of December and I'd only called on the 22nd. Not bad at Christmas time. Why - how long do you have to wait to see your GP? Now wait times to see specialists can be longer - a week or more at least IME (it depends a lot on the specialist's field and the resulting demand). But that's why you go see your GP - they'll fast track things as necessary. -- If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
From: Wes Groleau on 26 Dec 2009 20:05 William Clark wrote: > Which, I suppose, is why the US spends almost 50% more per person on > health care than other western countries with national health care > systems, but still winds up at 30th+ in the world's life expectancy > table. Well behind the same Europeans countries. According to the National Geographic chart I mentioned in another post, it's way more than 150% of the average. Then again, the life expectancy (according to the same chart) is about average. -- Wes Groleau Up-coming lesson on explicit grammar instruction http://Ideas.Lang-Learn.us/barrett?itemid=1589
From: Kurt Ullman on 27 Dec 2009 07:37 In article <hh6bsp$dh9$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, Wes Groleau <Groleau+news(a)FreeShell.org> wrote: > William Clark wrote: > > Which, I suppose, is why the US spends almost 50% more per person on > > health care than other western countries with national health care > > systems, but still winds up at 30th+ in the world's life expectancy > > table. Well behind the same Europeans countries. > > According to the National Geographic chart I mentioned in another post, > it's way more than 150% of the average. Then again, the life expectancy > (according to the same chart) is about average. Both life expectancy and infant mortality seem to be skewed by societal problems that are really outside the purview of medicine. For instance, life expectancy figures are impacted more by a 15 year old killed in a drive by than keeping a geezer alive another year or so. If you look at the rate of teenage pregnancies in developed countries, those with highest rates of pregnancy are in the lower tiers of infant mortality. Largely because teenage pregnancies have a higher level of low and extremely low birth weight babies. This is independent of who does the insurance program. The birth figures are futher skewed because there are major differences between countries on what constitutes a live birth. Some don't count babies born below a certain weight at live births and generally don't try to rescusitate. In the US, if they take anything resembling a first breath they are given full bore treatment despite very higher failure rates. When I hit the lottery, the first thing I am going to do is to pay for a study that tries to control for non-medical societal influences (such as the above) on these measures. Will be interesting to see how the US comes out. -- To find that place where the rats don't race and the phones don't ring at all. If once, you've slept on an island. Scott Kirby "If once you've slept on an island"
From: Warren Oates on 27 Dec 2009 08:50
In article <hh5gn5$8t4$2(a)news.eternal-september.org>, Wes Groleau <Groleau+news(a)FreeShell.org> wrote: > Not that it doesn't happen in USA--I lost a pound a day for two > months before a urine test showed where it was going. The only > reason I had the test was because it was routine when I showed up > at E.R. for something unrelated. C'mon Wes -- you let yourself lose 60 pounds before seeing a doctor? What, you thought you were just getting the benefits of that daily walk? The patients (us) have a responsibility to at least monitor their health. -- Very old woody beets will never cook tender. -- Fannie Farmer |