Does God need to prove He exists?
in [Physics]
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From: Antares 531 on 30 Jul 2008 10:14 On Mon, 26 May 2008 19:20:40 -0700 (PDT), mitch.nicolas.raemsch(a)gmail.com wrote: >No. I don't think so. > >"I want to know how God created this universe. All the rest are just >details." Albert Einstein > >Mitch Raemsch; Twice Nobel Laureate 2008 > I would like some insights and opinions on the book, Science and Religion by Paul Kurtz. Also, what is the general take on the magazine, Skeptical Inquirer? Are both these slanted severely to support the agnostic/atheist perspective, or are they relatively unbiased and reliable sources of intellectual insights into the matter of science and religion. Gordon
From: Matthew Johnson on 30 Jul 2008 10:59 In article <njt094524c4mp3ehncr8391vs6lo8o3udd(a)4ax.com>, Antares 531 says... > [snip] >I would like some insights and opinions on the book, Science and >Religion by Paul Kurtz. Have you looked at the reviews on Amazon? > Also, what is the general take on the >magazine, Skeptical Inquirer? The magazine gets some things right, but they have a slant of their own: it is the extreme reductionist/logical positivist slant. >Are both these slanted severely to support the agnostic/atheist >perspective, or are they relatively unbiased and reliable sources of >intellectual insights into the matter of science and religion. The magazine is certainly slanted in the way you suggest, not a source of "intellectual insights into the matter of science and religion" at all. Yet despite this weakness, they are still very good at exposing a great number of pseudo-scientific frauds.
From: Ben Dolan on 30 Jul 2008 12:37 rbwinn <rbwinn3(a)juno.com> wrote: > > >Well, I am sure you will try to prove me wrong. > > >Robert B. Winn > > > > Nobody has ever seen you proven right. > > > Well, maybe if they would open their eyes. Just an idea. I am not > saying any atheists actually have to do it. > Robert B. Winn "The way to see by Faith is to shut the Eye of Reason." --Ben Franklin
From: rbwinn on 30 Jul 2008 13:30 On Jul 30, 3:13�am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > rbwinn wrote: > > On Jul 22, 5:24 am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >> rbwinn wrote: > >>> On Jul 21, 8:39 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>> On Jul 21, 7:16 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" > >>>>> <alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: > >>>>>> On Jul 21, 5:51 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: > >>>>>>> On Jul 20, 7:54 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 2:53 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 10:00 am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 6:34 am, Stan-O <bndsna...(a)aol.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 22:27:44 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No, a couple of atheists have told me that. ?They said he was a > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Russian Orthodox and an alcoholic. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He was an alcoholic. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, you're making things up again. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint: He was not a Christian merely because an atheist claimed he was... > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint #2: ?What school did Stalin go to in 1888? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin went to a Russian Orthodox seminary. ?He rejected what he was > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taught there and became a mass murderer. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Only partially true. Like I told you before, politicians, and in > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particular tyrants, will say anything to gain or remain in power. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, Stalin did say he was an atheist. ?He told the truth about that. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He never openly admitted this. In fact, his religious beliefs were > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pretty vague. What he hated was the concept of god as presented by the > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ROC. He did, however, find a political use for the church when it > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suited his purpose.- Hide quoted text - > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is quite a statement. So you are saying that Stalin did not > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe in the Communist Manifesto? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tyrants will use or believe anything to maintain their control. He > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> probably found some parts useful, and ignored anything that > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> contradicted his personally ideologies...pretty much the same with you > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and your bible...- Hide quoted text - > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin tried to stamp out religion in the Soviet Union. It is well > >>>>>>>>>>>>> documented. > >>>>>>>>>>>> And what's that got to do with atheism? > >>>>>>>>>>> Stalin was a prominent atheist of his time who is claimed to have been > >>>>>>>>>>> a Christian by atheists of today. > >>>>>>>>>> Don't change the subject. What has what Stalin tried to do relevant to > >>>>>>>>>> atheism? > >>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> So what is the matter? Stalin and Pol Pot were atheists. They will > >>>>>>>>> never turn into Christians no matter how many times you try to claim > >>>>>>>>> they were. > >>>>>>>>> Don't you atheists ever take responsibility for anything? > >>>>>>>> Because what they did is irrelevant to me? Now, back onto the question > >>>>>>>> you are REFUSING to answer: > >>>>>>>> What has what Stalin tried to do ("tried to stamp out religion in the > >>>>>>>> Soviet Union") relevant to atheism? > >>>>>>> Stalin was an atheist. His values and beliefs were much like yours > >>>>>>> are today. > >>>>>>> Robert B. Winn > >>>>>> Torquemada was a christian. His values and beliefs were much like > >>>>>> yours are today. And you're doing your best to make us all see the > >>>>>> point of shooting christians. You really are. > >>>>>> Al- Hide quoted text - > >>>>> Well, let's talk about those feelings, Al. Pol Pot was just an > >>>>> unassuming atheistic school teacher until he became a Communist > >>>>> dictator. > >>>> So, really, aren't you talking about communism and totalitarianism? > >>>> What does atheism have to do with it? > >>> Under World Communism one of the pre-requisites for being a dictator > >>> was being an atheist. > >> Why? > > > Because Karl Marx said that religion was the opiate of the people. > > And...? > > > Religious people were not allowed to be Communist dictators. > > Cite? > Well, just go ahead and list all of the Communist dictators who were Christians, Daniel. Robert b. Winn
From: rbwinn on 30 Jul 2008 13:32
On Jul 30, 3:13�am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > rbwinn wrote: > > On Jul 22, 5:25 am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >> rbwinn wrote: > >>> On Jul 21, 8:49 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>> On Jul 21, 7:33 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>> On Jul 21, 6:38 am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 7:54 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 2:53 pm, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 10:00 am, DanielSan <daniel...(a)speakeasy.net> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 6:34 am, Stan-O <bndsna...(a)aol.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 22:27:44 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi....(a)juno.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No, a couple of atheists have told me that. ?They said he was a > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Russian Orthodox and an alcoholic. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He was an alcoholic. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, you're making things up again. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint: He was not a Christian merely because an atheist claimed he was... > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint #2: ?What school did Stalin go to in 1888? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin went to a Russian Orthodox seminary. ?He rejected what he was > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taught there and became a mass murderer. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Only partially true. Like I told you before, politicians, and in > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particular tyrants, will say anything to gain or remain in power. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, Stalin did say he was an atheist. ?He told the truth about that. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He never openly admitted this. In fact, his religious beliefs were > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pretty vague. What he hated was the concept of god as presented by the > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ROC. He did, however, find a political use for the church when it > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suited his purpose.- Hide quoted text - > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is quite a statement. So you are saying that Stalin did not > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe in the Communist Manifesto? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tyrants will use or believe anything to maintain their control. He > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> probably found some parts useful, and ignored anything that > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contradicted his personally ideologies...pretty much the same with you > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and your bible...- Hide quoted text - > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin tried to stamp out religion in the Soviet Union. It is well > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> documented. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> And what's that got to do with atheism? > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin was a prominent atheist of his time who is claimed to have been > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a Christian by atheists of today. > >>>>>>>>>>>> Don't change the subject. What has what Stalin tried to do relevant to > >>>>>>>>>>>> atheism? > >>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>> So what is the matter? Stalin and Pol Pot were atheists. They will > >>>>>>>>>>> never turn into Christians no matter how many times you try to claim > >>>>>>>>>>> they were. > >>>>>>>>>>> Don't you atheists ever take responsibility for anything? > >>>>>>>>>> Because what they did is irrelevant to me? Now, back onto the question > >>>>>>>>>> you are REFUSING to answer: > >>>>>>>>>> What has what Stalin tried to do ("tried to stamp out religion in the > >>>>>>>>>> Soviet Union") relevant to atheism? > >>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> It is relevant to atheism because Stalin was an atheist. > >>>>>>>> So, is it also relevant to masculinity? Stalin was a man, after all... > >>>>>>>> Stalin also had a mustache. Is that relevant, too? > >>>>>>>> Oh, Stalin was also born in December. Is that relevant? > >>>>>>>> Stalin married a wife. Is that relevant? > >>>>>>> Why don't you just decide for yourself what you think is relevant, > >>>>>>> Daniel? > >>>>>> How about none of it being relevant? > >>>>> Well, you get to decide for yourself. Don't be bashful. > >>>> Fine. He's a man. You're a man. I decide that you and Stalin are the > >>>> same. > >>>> Happy? > >>> I am happy. Josef Stalin was another story. > >> Okay, Mr Stalin. May I call you Stalin from now on? > > >> -- > > As far as I am concerned, you can do whatever you decide to do. �I do > > not pay any attention to what you do. > > This is obviously wrong since you're paying attention to what I post. �:-) > > -- Well, no, I just try to answer your questions. You just asked if you could call me Stalin. Robert B. Winn |