Does God need to prove He exists?
in [Physics]
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From: Free Lunch on 2 Jul 2008 19:03 On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 22:38:13 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism rbwinn <rbwinn3(a)juno.com> wrote in <57394af9-c4e1-41e3-9575-3efdee6c1eb9(a)k13g2000hse.googlegroups.com>: >On Jul 1, 7:11?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 18:23:02 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism >> rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in >> <5a6e721c-a4e8-41e0-b92d-5724b8818...(a)c58g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>: >> >> >> >> >> >> >On Jul 1, 1:13?pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> >> rbwinn wrote: >> >> >> >> atheists.- Hide quoted text - >> >> >> >> - Show quoted text - >> >> >> > Well, I am sure you will not. ?What would their reaction be to >> >> > discover that the apostle Paul had identified the theory of evolution >> >> > as a fable? >> >> >> They would accuse you of lying too. It's the only sensible reaction to >> >> your lies.- Hide quoted text - >> >> >> - Show quoted text - >> >> >Well, I think that is exactly right. ?Atheists accuse anyone who >> >disagrees with their atheistic doctrines of lying. >> >> That's your excuse. I call you a liar because you are lying. It has >> nothing to do with disagreeing with you, it has to do with the fact that >> you have chosen to lie repeatedly to us. It must be sad for you that >> everyone, even the lowly atheists, can see how totally untrustworthy and >> dishonest you are.- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > >Uh huh. Well, why is it that you think I should care what you think >about me? You should care about the impression you make. Being a liar doesn't earn you respect, not even from those who share your beliefs.
From: Free Lunch on 2 Jul 2008 19:03 On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 22:13:21 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism rbwinn <rbwinn3(a)juno.com> wrote in <f028bc18-d1bb-4772-a436-fb649e3ffce8(a)59g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>: >On Jul 1, 5:05?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> On Tue, 1 Jul 2008 07:31:29 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism >> rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in >> <ccc732d9-4c47-442b-ad22-fc806fe8b...(a)z66g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>: >> >> >> >> >> >> >On Jul 1, 12:32?am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> >> Free Lunch wrote: >> >> > On Mon, 30 Jun 2008 12:26:07 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism >> >> > rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in >> >> > <b804ab27-a92f-4ef2-a69c-54dd80028...(a)j33g2000pri.googlegroups.com>: >> >> >> On Jun 30, 12:25?am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> >> >>> Free Lunch wrote: >> >> >>>> On Sun, 29 Jun 2008 15:15:20 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> >> >>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> >> >>>>> On Jun 28, 6:06?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 17:26:59 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> >> >>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> >> >>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:50?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >>>>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 12:11:54 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> >> >>>>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> >> >>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 7:17?am, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> >> >>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 07:05:42 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:26?am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 27, 6:42?pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jack wrote: >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am upset by *people* who >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe that the Bible is anything more than mythology and try ?to impose >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beliefs on me ?using the Bible as evidence. >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How can someone impose a belief on you? ?Just believe whatever you want to >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe. >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The wrong part is when people attempt to use the myth to formulate >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> public policy or indoctrinate children or inform foreign policy. >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, actually they use fables. ?The apostles Paul said they would be >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> turned to fables in the last days. ?A fable is a story about animals >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> like the story about monkeys turning into humans. >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>> Wow, you're ignorant about evolution. Colour me surprised. >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> In what way am I ignorant about evolution? >> >> >>>>>>>>>> Monkeys and humans do share a common ancestor. Your denial of the fact >> >> >>>>>>>>>> does not change that fact.- Hide quoted text - >> >> >>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - >> >> >>>>>>>>> Charles Darwin was not my ancestor. >> >> >>>>>>>> So? >> >> >>>>>>>> Evolution happens. Learn to deal with reality.- Hide quoted text - >> >> >>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - >> >> >>>>>>> I never have believed in evolution. ?I think it is a fable, just as >> >> >>>>>>> Paul said it was. >> >> >>>>>> Paul knew nothing about it. You mock the Bible with such silly >> >> >>>>>> interpretations of it.- Hide quoted text - >> >> >>>>>> - Show quoted text - >> >> >>>>> I just believe what Paul said. ?You seem a little upset that I do not >> >> >>>>> believe your fable. >> >> >>>> Your problem is that you _lied_ about what Paul said. He _never_ said >> >> >>>> that evolution was a fable. That was the lie you told, one you cannot >> >> >>>> back up with _anything_ in the Bible, not from Paul, not from anywhere. >> >> >>> It's gotta be tough to keep 'em all in a row this far down the road!- Hide quoted text - >> >> >> >>> - Show quoted text - >> >> >> Well, if Paul had named Charles Darwin by name, atheists would claim >> >> >> he was not talking about evolution. >> >> >> > You know you lied to us, but you are trying to run away from your >> >> > behavior when you were caught. >> >> >> It is not weakness to admit a mistake, Robert. We won't tell the other >> >> atheists.- Hide quoted text - >> >> >> - Show quoted text - >> >> >Well, I am sure you will not. ?What would their reaction be to >> >discover that the apostle Paul had identified the theory of evolution >> >as a fable? >> >> He did not. You lied to us about that. Remember?- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > >Well, the best one to ask about that would be Paul. Paul is dead.
From: Free Lunch on 2 Jul 2008 19:05 On Wed, 2 Jul 2008 06:30:07 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism rbwinn <rbwinn3(a)juno.com> wrote in <9d32304c-87db-40a5-9926-554cefe797bd(a)k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com>: >On Jul 2, 12:13�am, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" ><alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: >> On Jul 2, 3:34 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> > On Jul 1, 6:43 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" >> >> > <alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: >> > > On Jul 2, 11:27 am, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: >> >> > > > On Jul 1, 1:14 pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> >> > > > > rbwinn wrote: >> > > > > > On Jul 1, 12:34 am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> > > > > >> rbwinn wrote: >> > > > > >>> On Jun 30, 12:25 am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> > > > > >>>> rbwinn wrote: >> > > > > >>>>> On Jun 28, 6:06?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 17:26:59 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> > > > > >>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> > > > > >>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:50?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 12:11:54 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> > > > > >>>>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 7:17?am, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 07:05:42 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:26?am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 27, 6:42?pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jack wrote: >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am upset by *people* who >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe that the Bible is anything more than mythology and try ?to impose >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beliefs on me ?using the Bible as evidence. >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How can someone impose a belief on you? ?Just believe whatever you want to >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe. >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The wrong part is when people attempt to use the myth to formulate >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> public policy or indoctrinate children or inform foreign policy. >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, actually they use fables. ?The apostles Paul said they would be >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> turned to fables in the last days. ?A fable is a story about animals >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> like the story about monkeys turning into humans. >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Wow, you're ignorant about evolution. Colour me surprised. >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> In what way am I ignorant about evolution? >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Monkeys and humans do share a common ancestor. Your denial of the fact >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> does not change that fact.- Hide quoted text - >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - >> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Charles Darwin was not my ancestor. >> > > > > >>>>>>>> So? >> > > > > >>>>>>>> Evolution happens. Learn to deal with reality.- Hide quoted text - >> > > > > >>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - >> > > > > >>>>>>> I never have believed in evolution. ?I think it is a fable, just as >> > > > > >>>>>>> Paul said it was. >> > > > > >>>>>> Paul knew nothing about it. You mock the Bible with such silly >> > > > > >>>>>> interpretations of it.- Hide quoted text - >> > > > > >>>>>> - Show quoted text - >> > > > > >>>>> I just believe what Paul said. �You seem a little upset that I do not >> > > > > >>>>> believe your fable. >> > > > > >>>> Can you please identify what he said about it? Please?- Hide quoted text - >> > > > > >>>> - Show quoted text - >> > > > > >>> 2 Tim 4:3 �For the time will come when they will not endure sound >> > > > > >>> doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves >> > > > > >>> teachers, having itching ears; >> > > > > >>> 4 � And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be >> > > > > >>> turned unto fables. >> > > > > >> I can't see any mention of evolution. I can't even see any description >> > > > > >> of the theory, or even a theistic strawman description. Can you help me >> > > > > >> out? You made a claim that seems difficult to substantiate.- Hide quoted text - >> >> > > > > >> - Show quoted text - >> >> > > > > > Well, I think we are getting into subject matter that is too difficult >> > > > > > for you. �Maybe we should go back to Hezekiah's tunnel. >> >> > > > > I'm not struggling, maybe you could point out the verse where evolution >> > > > > is singled out. Maybe he's talking about the germ theory of disease. I'm >> > > > > sure you believe that demons are behind illness, rather than pathogens.- Hide quoted text - >> >> > > > > - Show quoted text - >> >> > > > Well, Paul said that in the last days, men would be turned to fables >> > > > to explain things. �So today we see science explaining most things by >> > > > fables. >> > > > Robert B. Winn >> >> > > Please explain how "evolution" counts as a fable? �And we'll show you >> > > how you understanding of evolution is horribly wrong. >> >> > > Al- Hide quoted text - >> >> > > - Show quoted text - >> >> > Well, as Paul pointed out, in the last days men would be unable to >> > endure sound doctrine and would devise a fable to try to explain the >> > existence of mankind without a God. >> > Robert B. Winn >> >> That doesn't relate evolution to a fable. >> Do you ever answer a question that isn't just from your own >> imagination? >> >> Al- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > >It happened just the way Paul said it would. Yep, Paul knew that people would catch his BS.
From: Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al) on 2 Jul 2008 19:21 On Jul 3, 8:39 am, "Daniel Mandic" <daniel_man...(a)aon.at> wrote: > BuddyThunder wrote: > > Well, we don't have a centralised organisation telling us what to > > believe. We have to reach our own conclusions and values based on the > > information we have to hand. Consequently, we hold a variety of > > opinions. We're each responsible for our own conclusions, just as it > > should be. > > > It is a tactic, for developing a set of tools allowing us to > > appropriately deal with the world. > > Well spoken.... but i would suggest you to not remind religion > anymore.... otherwise you are seemingly ok > > Best regards, > > Daniel Mandic > > p.S.: I don't remind atheists when writing about god..... good Luck! > > -- And yet you still post gibberish into alt.atheism. Al
From: Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al) on 2 Jul 2008 19:27
On Jul 3, 9:05 am, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: > On Wed, 2 Jul 2008 06:30:07 -0700 (PDT), in alt.atheism > rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote in > <9d32304c-87db-40a5-9926-554cefe79...(a)k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com>: > > > > >On Jul 2, 12:13 am, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" > ><alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: > >> On Jul 2, 3:34 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: > > >> > On Jul 1, 6:43 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)" > > >> > <alwh...(a)optusnet.com.au> wrote: > >> > > On Jul 2, 11:27 am, rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> wrote: > > >> > > > On Jul 1, 1:14 pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > > >> > > > > rbwinn wrote: > >> > > > > > On Jul 1, 12:34 am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > >> > > > > >> rbwinn wrote: > >> > > > > >>> On Jun 30, 12:25 am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > >> > > > > >>>> rbwinn wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>> On Jun 28, 6:06?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 17:26:59 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> > >> > > > > >>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: > >> > > > > >>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:50?pm, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 12:11:54 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> > >> > > > > >>>>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 7:17?am, Free Lunch <lu...(a)nofreelunch.us> wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 28 Jun 2008 07:05:42 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...(a)juno.com> > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> wrote in alt.atheism: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:26?am, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 27, 6:42?pm, BuddyThunder <nos...(a)paradise.net.nz> wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jack wrote: > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am upset by *people* who > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe that the Bible is anything more than mythology and try ?to impose > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beliefs on me ?using the Bible as evidence. > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How can someone impose a belief on you? ?Just believe whatever you want to > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe. > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The wrong part is when people attempt to use the myth to formulate > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> public policy or indoctrinate children or inform foreign policy. > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, actually they use fables. ?The apostles Paul said they would be > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> turned to fables in the last days. ?A fable is a story about animals > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> like the story about monkeys turning into humans. > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Wow, you're ignorant about evolution. Colour me surprised. > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> In what way am I ignorant about evolution? > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Monkeys and humans do share a common ancestor. Your denial of the fact > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> does not change that fact.- Hide quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Charles Darwin was not my ancestor. > >> > > > > >>>>>>>> So? > >> > > > > >>>>>>>> Evolution happens. Learn to deal with reality.- Hide quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>>>>>> - Show quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>>>>> I never have believed in evolution. ?I think it is a fable, just as > >> > > > > >>>>>>> Paul said it was. > >> > > > > >>>>>> Paul knew nothing about it. You mock the Bible with such silly > >> > > > > >>>>>> interpretations of it.- Hide quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>>>> - Show quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>>> I just believe what Paul said. You seem a little upset that I do not > >> > > > > >>>>> believe your fable. > >> > > > > >>>> Can you please identify what he said about it? Please?- Hide quoted text - > >> > > > > >>>> - Show quoted text - > >> > > > > >>> 2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound > >> > > > > >>> doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves > >> > > > > >>> teachers, having itching ears; > >> > > > > >>> 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be > >> > > > > >>> turned unto fables. > >> > > > > >> I can't see any mention of evolution. I can't even see any description > >> > > > > >> of the theory, or even a theistic strawman description. Can you help me > >> > > > > >> out? You made a claim that seems difficult to substantiate.- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > >> - Show quoted text - > > >> > > > > > Well, I think we are getting into subject matter that is too difficult > >> > > > > > for you. Maybe we should go back to Hezekiah's tunnel. > > >> > > > > I'm not struggling, maybe you could point out the verse where evolution > >> > > > > is singled out. Maybe he's talking about the germ theory of disease. I'm > >> > > > > sure you believe that demons are behind illness, rather than pathogens.- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > - Show quoted text - > > >> > > > Well, Paul said that in the last days, men would be turned to fables > >> > > > to explain things. So today we see science explaining most things by > >> > > > fables. > >> > > > Robert B. Winn > > >> > > Please explain how "evolution" counts as a fable? And we'll show you > >> > > how you understanding of evolution is horribly wrong. > > >> > > Al- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > - Show quoted text - > > >> > Well, as Paul pointed out, in the last days men would be unable to > >> > endure sound doctrine and would devise a fable to try to explain the > >> > existence of mankind without a God. > >> > Robert B. Winn > > >> That doesn't relate evolution to a fable. > >> Do you ever answer a question that isn't just from your own > >> imagination? > > >> Al- Hide quoted text - > > >> - Show quoted text - > > >It happened just the way Paul said it would. > > Yep, Paul knew that people would catch his BS. It is a very reliable prediction when everything else he happens to be saying is complete garbage. It's wonderful mental slight of hand. Meaningful it ain't, but top notch quackery. Al |