Vulcan .Net and VO 2.8
in [Visual Objects]
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From: Graham McKechnie on 20 Sep 2006 18:05 Robert, >> This is why it is a flawed business model. Grafx punishes their own users >> for not joining their "exclusive little club thingy". > > VOPS is not exclusive. Everybody can subscribe. Only one company has been > excluded for reasons that have been explained on this newsgroup. Robert you must live too close to this thing. You can't see the wood for the trees. The VOPS "club thingy" is as exclusive as it gets. If your superior can kick people out of it (I don't care why) then it is exclusive period, no buts, no questions - its just bloody "exclusive and very clubby". The whole of the business model of VOPS is so basically flawed its a joke - try selling it to some big shot IT guy - you wouldn't even get a chance. > I am sorry, but this is nonsense: > > - VO 2.7 was released in 2004 > - There have been FREE bug fixes in 2004 and 2005. > - The latest public build was from februari 2005 (2.7b build 2740) and is > not flawed. You may think its nonsense, but I doubt too many people here agree with you. Haven't you noticed all the unhappy campers here? Just yesterday we read about Heiko leaving your "exclusive little club thingy", because he was fed up with the progress. Just re read this thread again, (and all the previous threads on the same subject) and count your unhappy users - and what about the ones just lurking. You guys must be living in a vacuum if you can't see the discontent here. I see you've just released a minor upgrade to VO (2.8) but you admit that its taken since 2004, with 2 very minor bug releases in the interim. I doubt that many people around here would call that progress when you compare what other software companies do. It's about time you listen to the feedback that your customers and ex customers give you. A minor release of VO (2.8) has just been annouced. In the past when such an occurence happened there was great joy here. Lots of congratulations etc, back slapping - this part of the world was a fun place to be etc. Go check out the responses today - no happy faces there, absolutely no enthusiam for a new release, not one word of congratulations - just more complaints. It appears you can't even get the web site working properly, so its not hard to postulate that the software will probably work like the web site. The responses to that thread tell you that these guys have just lost faith in your ability to produce a product and provide timely bug fixes. Crowing that you provided 2 free bug fixes since 2004 is just an insult to the intelligence of these guys. I've said before that you guys are arrogant - well I suppose that was just another dose, the poor buggers here had to cop. Graham "Robert van der Hulst" <E-55525A53-2461-E(a)heliks.nl> wrote in message news:991378088.20060920225142(a)heliks.nl... > Hi Mullet, > On Wed, 20 Sep 2006, at 20:20:06 [GMT GMT] (which was 22:20 where I live) > you wrote about: 'Vulcan .Net and VO 2.8' > >> This is why it is a flawed business model. Grafx punishes their own users >> for not joining their "exclusive little club thingy". > > VOPS is not exclusive. Everybody can subscribe. Only one company has been > excluded for reasons that have been explained on this newsgroup. > >> NON-VOPS users don't get any bug fixes period. They spend money for >> flawed software and have to spend more for the fixes. Any software I buy >> has >> at least 1 year of bug fixes. I wouldn't buy it if I didn't. Grafx >> doesn't >> even have a web site explaining what is coming in the next release. > > I am sorry, but this is nonsense: > > - VO 2.7 was released in 2004 > - There have been FREE bug fixes in 2004 and 2005. > - The latest public build was from februari 2005 (2.7b build 2740) and is > not flawed. > - A new release has just been announced: see the 'Official VO 2.8 > Announcement thread in this newsgroup that also has link to a page > with a summary of the changes in this new build. > > > -- > Robert van der Hulst > VO Development Team > >
From: Geoff Schaller on 20 Sep 2006 18:07 Nonsense. You are being obtuse only for the sake of argument. You must read Heiko's post in context and not in isolation. The clear message is simple. The "ease" of using and learning C# or VB is in the wealth of samples and support for those languages. Vulcan will be nothing more than a curious side-show in the IT world. "Karl Faller" <k.faller_withoutthat_(a)onlinehome.de> wrote in message news:tao2h2lngo8jb63qoq5ls2455dl1tcps1q(a)4ax.com: > Geoff, > > >Really? Are you offering? > > No i don't. If you would have read what i wrote, you could have > realised that i have doubts converting code from any .net lang to > another being so "simple" as Heiko told. > Karl
From: Geoff Schaller on 20 Sep 2006 18:12 Ginny, If you've been reading any of my posts it would have been thoroughly clear that we are not converting anything. We routinely use VO and Dot Net executables in the same execution application environment. New stuff and web services are being created with ASP.Net and C# - VO is called and executed as needed and vice versa. This to us is the important facet. We maintain full use of our legacy VO executables and code base but most new work is done in Dot net. I hope that makes things clearer. Geoff "Ginny Caughey" <ginny.caughey.online(a)wasteworks.com> wrote in message news:4ncnc7F9on6uU1(a)individual.net: > Geoff, > > > >2 weeks and you will be perfectly fluent in C# > > 2 months and you will match your VO productivity (mostly) > > > This is probably true. But how long is it taking you to recreate your big VO > apps in C#? Or are you even attempting that? > > Ginny
From: Geoff Schaller on 20 Sep 2006 18:19 Marc, You're not being fair here. So you have now disclosed that you are paying GrafX or Robert additional money on top of your VOPS subscription for extra services (and you wouldn't be alone). So this proves that VOPS on its own does not provide you with sufficient development, that there is a club within a club and exclusive treatment available for a premium. It would also explain why you are being a proxy for GrafX in these discussions. Geoff "Marc Verkade [Marti IT]" <marcatM(a)rtidotnl> wrote in message news:45116179$0$26918$58c7af7e(a)news.kabelfoon.nl: > OK, here is you answer, just in case you did not figure this uot for > yourself, > I bought VO and am paying maintenace money to them and am getting updates > and fixes as do my own customers... Does that answer your question? > Grtz, Marc > > "rob" <rob_panosh(a)asdsoftware.com> schreef in bericht > news:1158753655.877412.136540(a)i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
From: Geoff Schaller on 20 Sep 2006 18:26
Robert, Now you are being ridiculous. There have been no free bug fixes for over 18 months. Do you call that effective product management? Build 2740 is flawed and the number of posts in this forum alone is proof. Plus, as all VOPS members in 2005 know, there were a flurry of important patches fixing the re-introduced bugs and things missed in 2740. You yourself also had to advise COMSDK users to use earlier versions of linkers and Sven Ebert has had to work overtime providing GUI class fixes to folks to repair partial introductions made in 2740. The catalog of complaints is long and no amount of positive spin by you or Brian will change that. A new release has just been announced? Big deal. VO 2.8 was announced over 3 years ago in Nuremberg and almost all of the promised features in that announcement will not be in the new product. Geoff > > I am sorry, but this is nonsense: > > - VO 2.7 was released in 2004 > - There have been FREE bug fixes in 2004 and 2005. > - The latest public build was from februari 2005 (2.7b build 2740) and is > not flawed. > - A new release has just been announced: see the 'Official VO 2.8 > Announcement thread in this newsgroup that also has link to a page > with a summary of the changes in this new build. > > > -- > Robert van der Hulst > VO Development Team |